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| The Afterlife; Heaven and Hell | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 6 2006, 08:34 AM (1,207 Views) | |
| piercehawkeye45 | Oct 9 2006, 09:54 PM Post #31 |
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Franklin Pierce
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I took a college level pyschology class and I was specifically told that once you get hysterical blindness, no matter how hard you try, you can't get rid of it until your subconcious mind, which you have no control over, decides it isn't needed anymore. So if you think that a college level course is teaching bullshit be my guest but I would really trust that over your opinion.
That is why rape victims (young girls) often have their bad memories blocked into their subconcious where they can not remember being raped. Usually the only way to tab into the subconcious mind is to use hypnosis and even that fails. It may just be my opinion again, but I think rape is something that is usually worth bothering for. Another example, I came up with this one by myself so I don't have proof but this is a good example of the subconcious keeping then letting the concious mind have information. Have you ever liked a girl/guy and could only think of one or two things that you don't like about her/him. Then when he/she does something for you not to like her you immediately can come up with many things you don't like about her when you couldn't have before. Another example is the tip of the tongue phenomenon. You know you know the information but it is still hidden in the subconcious mind. |
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Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed I'm America! I have found the enemy and he is us. | |
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| 严加华 | Oct 9 2006, 11:10 PM Post #32 |
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Magister Ludicrous
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It is always best to be interested in that which does not exist, or which, at most, is an epiphenomenon of something far more difficult to grasp. That way one can avoid rigour in thought and application.
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LC Sez:
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| Necronomicon | Oct 9 2006, 11:55 PM Post #33 |
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omar comin' yo
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Kalkin, given that you are admitting 'mind' is a product of 'brain', then the brain determines everything and the mind can only be affected by altering the brain (as you admitted originally, when you made a concession for brain damage). There is no 'third component'. |
| omar yo. omar comin | |
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| Kalkin | Oct 10 2006, 09:04 AM Post #34 |
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Disgraced Dictator
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Necronomicon wrote:No, it's the other way around. Mind alters brains. Stuff happens in mind, and it gets scarred into neurons via memory proteins allowing mental events to be recalled later. It's called 'memorizing' things. piercehawkeye45 wrote:
Your college teacher was making trying make point about psychology. He overdid it a bit to rub it in. You should read Popper's theory of falsification. He makes a point that science cannot create positive proof, only negative proof. This means that scientific experiments can only exclude specific possibilities by creating results that form contradicting examples. Everything is possible, except specific scenarios that have been ruled out one by one. When your college teacher said consciousness can never ever under any circumstances and with any amount of practise in any way influence subconsiousness he was making a good teaching point for learning canonised psychology but he also made bad science. Neuroscience may be your alley, but philosophy of the mind and philosophy of science are mine.
That example strengthens my case. Hypnosis is notorious for being very inaccurate for remembering stuff, becomes the mind can simply invent new memories upon suggestions of the hypnotizer. That's what retrogression is all about. Edited by Kalkin, Sep 2 2011, 02:47 AM.
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| Kalkin | Oct 10 2006, 09:08 AM Post #35 |
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Disgraced Dictator
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Uups, I wrote:
My mistake, replace with: When young girls get raped and they suppress memories, such a persons mind... |
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| piercehawkeye45 | Oct 10 2006, 12:12 PM Post #36 |
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Franklin Pierce
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If I hold a gun at your face and no matter how hard you try, you aren't going to stop me because it is out of your control. If I do stop it is because I decided too. This is what hystericall blindness is but your subconcious is holding the gun to your face while your kneeling on the floor crying. I know you can not crate positive proof but if we used this thoery in arguments, we would all sound pretty pathetic wouldn't we.
If it would help the person then why does the subconcious supress the memories in the first place? |
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Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed I'm America! I have found the enemy and he is us. | |
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| Kalkin | Oct 10 2006, 06:03 PM Post #37 |
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Disgraced Dictator
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piercehawkeye45 wrote:
Yes I can. I can disregard the gun and run at you and try to punch you in the throat. It might not be wise, it might require lots of will power and stupidity, It might be very rare in real world, but it's not impossible. Not by a long shot.
Theory or no theory, anything is possible, unless there is a specific counter example to contradict it. Excluding possibilities outright is opinion, not science.
Everyone forgets 99% of everything anyway. Trauma is just one more factor to distract people further. 99.9% from the time of trauma would constitute a major memory blockage, but in absolute terms it would not be a significant difference to 99%. Edited by Kalkin, Sep 2 2011, 02:53 AM.
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| piercehawkeye45 | Oct 10 2006, 08:01 PM Post #38 |
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Franklin Pierce
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Do you have proof for this? You have no idea if you've even been in a situation where you would need this backup so don't comment on other people and their "weaknesses" unless you have been in a similar situation.
No, the conscious and unconscious, the actual term of the subconscious, serve two different purposes.
Try to stick with the analogy if you can, you can't run at your subconscious. It was a bad analogy but I was getting at the power struggle. Now I will agree with the fact that we can control ourselves a lot more than one would suspect but you said that we have total control and we don't. I just want to make sure we aren't straying too much from the main disagreement. |
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Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed I'm America! I have found the enemy and he is us. | |
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| NeoAegis | Oct 10 2006, 08:10 PM Post #39 |
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Israel thug life
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Just for future reference, you have an "Edit" button at the top right corner of your post. If you could use that instead of double-posting, that'd be appreciated. Thanks. (Directed to Kalkin... Damn it, pierce, don't post before I do!) Also, people knew the world was not flat before Columbus. >_> |
![]() ![]() Exit Mundi Post of the Year | |
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| Flamingo | Oct 10 2006, 09:12 PM Post #40 |
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Penis goes in here
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I heard people still think the world is flat and that NASA photos are fake. |
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| Kalkin | Oct 10 2006, 10:25 PM Post #41 |
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Disgraced Dictator
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NeoAegis wrote:
It still didn't become general knowledge until Columbus found America and it wasn't undeniably proven until Magellan expedition. piercehawkeye45 wrote:
Well no, I just thougt it fits nicely. Well, I won't start a war on that one. Feel free to prove me wrong.
No they don't, they have same purpose. Subconscious just has bottom-up approach while consciousness has top-down approach. The rest is just a matter of degree.
How about a compromise: Total control is possible, but so difficult to achieve that it remains only as a theoretic possibility. Edited by Kalkin, Sep 2 2011, 03:00 AM.
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| piercehawkeye45 | Oct 10 2006, 10:45 PM Post #42 |
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Franklin Pierce
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To accomplish this you would need outside help. Going on your example, lets say the master wants to find a bomb (event or answer to a question that he can't find) that his servent hid in such a remote place that no matter how hard the master looked he can not find it. Then he calls in the a bomb sniffing dog (hypnosis) to help the master find the bomb. I don't know if we can unlock everything because the mind is so complex but we can figure out more things about ourselves then we can imagine. |
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Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed I'm America! I have found the enemy and he is us. | |
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| 严加华 | Oct 10 2006, 11:02 PM Post #43 |
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Magister Ludicrous
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Our "enlightened" European here seems to forget that the world exists outside of Europe. Which is funny considering that he's constantly bashing the ignorance of Americans. In other news, irony is my favourite form of humour. Especially the unintentional variety. |
LC Sez:
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| Kalkin | Oct 11 2006, 12:25 AM Post #44 |
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Disgraced Dictator
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严加华 wrote:
How would you know? Have you ever seen a map of the World? piercehawkeye45 wrote:
Well, indirect help isn't excluded, it is just unnecessary. Easiest way is to simply order the servant to defuse it. The master doesn't have to lay his own hands on it himself. Edited by Kalkin, Sep 2 2011, 03:08 AM.
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| piercehawkeye45 | Oct 11 2006, 04:21 AM Post #45 |
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Franklin Pierce
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If you could just order the servent to diffuse it then why would the servent hide it from the master in the first place? |
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Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed I'm America! I have found the enemy and he is us. | |
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