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Animal Rights
Topic Started: Oct 30 2006, 03:19 AM (2,842 Views)
严加华
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Magister Ludicrous
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Altanese
Dec 17 2006, 12:48 AM
严加华
Dec 16 2006, 08:31 AM
You destroy life with each breath you take, sabertooth.  I assume you'll be slaughtering yourself forthwith to stop being a mass murderer?

The difference is that some murders are intentional (beating a child or kitten with a shovel), some are un-intentional (destroying millions of bacteria), and some are intentional, but unavoidable (eating anything, including plants)

Murder, by definition, cannot be unintentional.

That aside, if you're going to take the ridiculous stance that no single life is worth more than another, you're going to have to deal with the guilt of "murdering" (or "manslaughtering" if you know what "murder" actually means) literally billions of individual lives over the span of your own.

And, that being said, since you think killing a cat with a shovel is morally the same as kiling a baby with a shovel, and further you think that eating anything is "intentional, but unavoidable", would you say that eating a human being, then, is fine morally speaking? If not, why not? If you want to redirect the discussion to plants, explain why plants are OK to eat but not animals.

Basically, your position that "each and every life is worth the same" is nonsense and it takes no more than about fifteen seconds of thought to demonstrate the foolishness off it.
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Altanese
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严加华
Dec 17 2006, 03:05 AM
would you say that eating a human being, then, is fine morally speaking?

If theres no avoiding it, yeah. You COULD eat a person and not even know it. And either way, for most people, they don't kill a damn thing when they eat (other than microscopic organisms, but never the thing they're eating) I'm not saying that any of that is wrong, I'm saying that killing anything for any reason other than survival or it is unintentional is wrong.
Deep unspeakable suffering may well be called a baptism, a regeneration, the initiation into a new state.
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严加华
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Magister Ludicrous
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And this is the point where talking to animal rights extremists takes such a turn into never-never land that it's fruitless to speak with them.

Go ahead: eat people and live in a world where having someone else kill things for you means you're not culpable in its death. Just stay the Smurf! away from me and mine you lunatic.
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Gopher_dude
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*dons the ape tribe suit of animal rights and throws rocks sticks and small rodents like in princess mononoke*

Let the lesser animals be eaten sutch as pig, dog, horse things that walk on fours, things that fly, things that can't talk back. The only animal that is against my beliefs are every ape and monkey.

Apes and monkeys (whales dolphins I guess..but really you could eat them don't know what whale taste like probebly like a chewy cow like fish thing?) apes and monkeys never eat any ape or monkeys. Monkeys and apes are as human as you or me or tom joad or killer bee....not neo though. Anyway you can kill as many farm animals you want as long as you can finish your plate. Don't be greedy. Don't kill somthing and leave it there. Wear fur. Kill somthing thourouly (can't spell) make sure it's dead.

But I'm serios on the apes thing..you can teach an ape anything we know exsept talking. They are us and we are them. We are apes and should respect them like we would ourselves, friends and family.

P.s I like chicken, pork, chicken, and why does salmon smell like everything related to sex?
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NeoAegis
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Gopher_dude
Dec 17 2006, 01:00 AM
Monkeys and apes are as human as you or me or tom joad or killer bee....not neo though.

Have I done something to incur your wrath? o_0
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piercehawkeye45
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You have sympathy for apes because they are similar to you. Just as you would save your father over a stranger.

The reason we would kill thousands of animals to save one human is because we feel closer to any human then any other animal. It is how social species survive; you watch out for your own kind. There is no need to fight it because it is in our genes.
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严加华
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Magister Ludicrous
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Gopher_dude
Dec 17 2006, 02:00 PM
Apes and monkeys (whales dolphins I guess..but really you could eat them don't know what whale taste like probebly like a chewy cow like fish thing?)

Whale tastes pretty good, actually. Even the fat is a tasty treat (served raw).
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Gopher_dude
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严加华
Dec 17 2006, 09:21 AM
Gopher_dude
Dec 17 2006, 02:00 PM
Apes and monkeys (whales dolphins I guess..but really you could eat them don't know what whale taste like probebly like a chewy cow like fish thing?)

Whale tastes pretty good, actually. Even the fat is a tasty treat (served raw).

Hawkeye: That was rather well put. I like your responce.

Neo: *pounds on chest chucking sticks and rocks at you while jumping up and down*

Huh really? I'll have to try whale some time in my life time then. I was actualy expecting anyone to have even though of eating sutch an animal.
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NeoAegis
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I feel enlightened.
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sabertooth
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Like gopher said you you can kill as many farm animals you want as long as you can finish your plate.

But people who do this for intertainment need to get a life.
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not a mountain after all.

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Killer Bee
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严加华
Dec 17 2006, 09:21 AM
Whale tastes pretty good, actually.

So does ape and monkey, providing they're cooked all the way through.


Anyways, killing animals for our survival(food, furs, ect.) is natural, just think of a pride of lions killing an impala it's very brutal but necessary for the lion's survival. Where I draw the line is unjustified slaughtering of animals, saying that it's just an animal. Using that logic, humans aren't anything special we're just animals. Except, if an animal attacks and kills a human it's put down because it killed a human. So, if an animal kills another animal then why should one animal be allowed to get it's revenge?
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piercehawkeye45
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Killer Bee
Dec 18 2006, 12:46 PM
So, if an animal kills another animal then why should one animal be allowed to get it's revenge?

Because that is how humans work. We naturally put ourselves and the ones close to us above everything else. If another human kills one of your friends its natural for you to seek revenge. Just as another animal kills a friend we naturally will seek revenge on it.

Then we also have the idea that if one animal kills a human it is a danger to every other human which makes it our "duty" to put it down. If you take a baby away from a human mother and she kills you, the mother is a good mother and will use self-defense. If you take a baby away from a bear and the mother kills you, the bear is a blood-thirsty animal who needs to be put down before she rampages and kills more humans.

Yet there are times when we need to put down an animal that is a threat to society (like any other murderer) but you won't be seeing a dog going to court for attacking a little girl, only a needle or a gun.

On a lighter note, if you ever see a deer holding a gun, it would be in your best intrest to run like hell in the opposite direction.
Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real
Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed
I'm America!

I have found the enemy and he is us.
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Killer Bee
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piercehawkeye45
Dec 18 2006, 06:16 PM
Killer Bee
Dec 18 2006, 12:46 PM
So, if an animal kills another animal then why should one animal be allowed to get it's revenge?

Because that is how humans work. We naturally put ourselves and the ones close to us above everything else. If another human kills one of your friends its natural for you to seek revenge. Just as another animal kills a friend we naturally will seek revenge on it.

Then we also have the idea that if one animal kills a human it is a danger to every other human which makes it our "duty" to put it down. If you take a baby away from a human mother and she kills you, the mother is a good mother and will use self-defense. If you take a baby away from a bear and the mother kills you, the bear is a blood-thirsty animal who needs to be put down before she rampages and kills more humans.

Yet there are times when we need to put down an animal that is a threat to society (like any other murderer) but you won't be seeing a dog going to court for attacking a little girl, only a needle or a gun.

On a lighter note, if you ever see a deer holding a gun, it would be in your best intrest to run like hell in the opposite direction.

Can it be said that possibly an animal attacking and killing a human is revenge for all of the animals humans kill with no justification?
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piercehawkeye45
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Not all the animals. If you kill an animal and a group of that species of animal come after you then you could say that is revenge but I personally have never seen it (intrusion of space is probably the main reason for attacks on humans).

Group revenge (genocide) or revenge that lasts over a few days seem to be only a human characteristic.
Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real
Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed
I'm America!

I have found the enemy and he is us.
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Gri3vous
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Animals are tasty so I will eat them.
"philosophy is like scientific masturbation... it's enjoyable, sure, but it can't yield a real, tangible outcome and in the end it's not all that satisfying..."-Darth Stumpy

"I'm going to hell anyways, so might as well enjoy the ride there."-NeoAegis
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