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Fascism in America; In 10 easy steps...
Topic Started: Apr 24 2007, 09:09 PM (2,508 Views)
Mister Sinister
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Comrade Jim
May 2 2007, 10:15 AM
Democracy is the only way to keep leaders in check

Yeah, right. While the threat of losing an election may prompt a politician to pay more attention to the masses, it only prompts that politician once every few years.

In between a democracy might as well be (or has extreme potential to be) an Oligarchy or even an Autocracy or a Fascist state, where the will of the people has absolutely NO swagger in the day-to-day decision making. See: Neo-Con

Right now, the only thing seperating the democratic experiment in the New World from places like pre-War Iraq is that eventually, the dictator has to leave.

So, "How big of a check?" is really the question. The answer varies from one Democratic leader to another. Look at the checks we put on Clinton, then compare them to the checks we haven't put on Bush.
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Brutus
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Planning World Domination
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anarchy only works on a very very small scale, maybe a hamlet or small village, anything bigger and people abuse the fact that their is no police force or anything.

if you go by its stricktest definition then no country has ever been communist, you are just gonna have to settle for calling countrys that are incredibly socialist and aim to be communist, communist.

also communism comes in so many different strains and brands that its hard to pin down one defintion, Stalin and trotscky both had incredibly different beleifs but both of their beleifs were completely communist.
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piercehawkeye45
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Brutus
May 2 2007, 11:12 AM
anarchy only works on a very very small scale, maybe a hamlet or small village, anything bigger and people abuse the fact that their is no police force or anything.

That isn't nessessarly true.

Spain was basically an anarchist state for 50 years and they didn't have much of a problem. It wasn't true anarchy but it also wasn't anarchy that made it fall.
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DirkNL
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piercehawkeye45
May 2 2007, 06:36 PM
Brutus
May 2 2007, 11:12 AM
anarchy only works on a very very small scale, maybe a hamlet or small village, anything bigger and people abuse the fact that their is no police force or anything.

That isn't nessessarly true.

Spain was basically an anarchist state for 50 years and they didn't have much of a problem. It wasn't true anarchy but it also wasn't anarchy that made it fall.

Not to mention the many anarchies you see on the Internets and Anarchist Catalonia which worked quite well (untill it got invaded).

-Dirk
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Killer Bee
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Mister Sinister
May 2 2007, 03:35 PM
So, "How big of a check?" is really the question. The answer varies from one Democratic leader to another. Look at the checks we put on Clinton, then compare them to the checks we haven't put on Bush.

This is why America was still a more respected and prospering nation for the 8 years before Dubya. Now, it's a "I'll do it if I damn well please" kind of leadership. I don't care about Clinton getting a blowjob in office, it didn't cost anyone their lives or put us in debt until we'll never see daylight again. I imagine one of the biggest reasons no one has taken serious steps to impeach Bush is fear of being labeled a "terrorist" and conspiring against the U.S. interests, afterwords being shoved into a hole never to be heard from again.
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Faust
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Anarchist societies are doomed to failure. Either they will evolve in to an organised state by their own free will or be destroyed by one. History is full of such examples.
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BohemianG
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Killer Bee
May 2 2007, 05:50 PM
This is why America was still a more respected and prospering nation for the 8 years before Dubya. Now, it's a "I'll do it if I damn well please" kind of leadership. I don't care about Clinton getting a blowjob in office, it didn't cost anyone their lives or put us in debt until we'll never see daylight again. I imagine one of the biggest reasons no one has taken serious steps to impeach Bush is fear of being labeled a "terrorist" and conspiring against the U.S. interests, afterwords being shoved into a hole never to be heard from again.

Well the bigger problem with Clinton was that he lied, but still, that particular lie wasn't on a par with "Saddam had a hand in 9/11" or "Saddam's weapons threaten the West". And you're right, if anyone made any serious attempts to impeach Bush they would be beaten down by the establishment and brainwashed right-wingers.
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Normandy took more balls than Vietnam, it took more balls than Korea, it took more balls than facing mustard gas on a battlefield full of giant ditches with nowhere to run. It took more balls than the world will ever be able to ante up again.
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严加华
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Comrade Jim
May 2 2007, 11:15 PM
Democracy is the only way to keep leaders in check

Most of the great dictators of the 20th century were voted into power.

In other news, America's getting closer and closer, baby-step by baby-step:

Wired Magazine
 
"This is the final nail in the coffin for combat blogging," said retired paratrooper Matthew Burden, editor of The Blog of War anthology. "No more military bloggers writing about their experiences in the combat zone. This is the best PR the military has -- it's most honest voice out of the war zone. And it's being silenced."

...

Active-duty troops aren't the only ones affected by the new guidelines. Civilians working for the military, Army contractors -- even soldiers' families -- are all subject to the directive as well.


(Emphasis mine.)

Read the whole thing here.
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piercehawkeye45
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Faust
May 2 2007, 01:10 PM
Anarchist societies are doomed to failure. Either they will evolve in to an organised state by their own free will or be destroyed by one. History is full of such examples.

We have no idea because every anarchical society that has done decently well has been corrupted by other means and not by anarchy failing from within.

My guess is that it, with most left winged economies, will have a shorter lifespan than the more right winged systems but it could hold its own if it was given a chance. Now that the world is more stable, I am fairly confident an anarchical state could survive for a few centuries.
Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real
Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed
I'm America!

I have found the enemy and he is us.
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Faust
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Ok, i admit that failure from within isn't the inherent fate of all such societies. But can an anarchist society withstand the aggression of an expansionist organized centalized state?
My opinion is that it can't. And so far i have not found any examples to the contrary.
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I am the tomb of every hope
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DirkNL
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Faust
May 3 2007, 07:02 PM
Ok, i admit that failure from within isn't the inherent fate of all such societies. But can an anarchist society withstand the aggression of an expansionist organized centalized state?
My opinion is that it can't. And so far i have not found any examples to the contrary.

Unless, of course, the citizens are aware of it and start mobilizing themselves.

-Dirk
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Comrade Jim
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Mister Sinister
 

Right now, the only thing seperating the democratic experiment in the New World from places like pre-War Iraq is that eventually, the dictator has to leave.
What the Smurf! are you on about? You think Saddam would have to the problems with the media and congress (if he had one) like Bush does?
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Rhas BloodBear
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Killer Bee
May 2 2007, 08:50 AM
Mister Sinister
May 2 2007, 03:35 PM
So, "How big of a check?" is really the question.  The answer varies from one Democratic leader to another.  Look at the checks we put on Clinton, then compare them to the checks we haven't put on Bush.

This is why America was still a more respected and prospering nation for the 8 years before Dubya. Now, it's a "I'll do it if I damn well please" kind of leadership. I don't care about Clinton getting a blowjob in office, it didn't cost anyone their lives or put us in debt until we'll never see daylight again. I imagine one of the biggest reasons no one has taken serious steps to impeach Bush is fear of being labeled a "terrorist" and conspiring against the U.S. interests, afterwords being shoved into a hole never to be heard from again.

3rd time today that I completely agree with you.
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piercehawkeye45
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Faust
May 3 2007, 12:02 PM
Ok, i admit that failure from within isn't the inherent fate of all such societies. But can an anarchist society withstand the aggression of an expansionist organized centalized state?
My opinion is that it can't. And so far i have not found any examples to the contrary.

They are called militias.

An anarchical society isn’t as specialized so most people will know how to fight and a few will be very good at it. I don’t see how that is any different from any other military.
Dropped the atomic bomb let them know that it's real
Speak soft with a big stick do what I say or be killed
I'm America!

I have found the enemy and he is us.
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Brutus
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another reason i think diplomacy is doomed to fail (all be it after a long time) is because people don't vote for the best politician, they vote for the charismatic one who is good public speaker.

one of my friends said he voted a for a local politician because she had very large breasts.

their are thousands of tiny settlements dotted all over the planet that have no form of government whatsoever, and their all little hamlets because Anarchy doesn't work on a larger scale and as a anarchist settlement gets larger, it slowly develops a heirarchy and a government.

all these anarchist settlements are also tribal and far off settlements that may be in a country that is not anarchist but in but are De facto anarchist because they have no state laws to follow or taxes to pay or anything.

the reason why anarachy only works on a small scale is because of the people themselves.

if their is 50 people in ananarchist society and their is a murder, the townspeople will try and find who did it themselves and punich the murderer themselves as well, but such a system is impossible in a city with thousands of people and some form of heirarchy is needed to lead the people.
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