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Mad Men
Topic Started: Jan 25 2013, 11:26 AM (11,108 Views)
IcyAll
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I thought it was a good episode. I hope that the FIL takes a big hit from Trudy, but I suspect that's the last we'll see of Trudy and her father and mother as story-line movers. They might make once in a while appearances, for the divorce, but what would be the reason? I'm more interested in seeing Peggy's mother and sister and her SON. He'd be ... six now? Pete and Peggy together again! That's what I'm interested in ...

Don ... "I did this wrong before" then tells Peggy 'congrats on your demotion' ... takes Ted to put a good spin on it. I wouldn't put it past Don to have thought about getting Peggy back as part of his motivation for the merger ...

And count me in on those who think phone calls were made before any merger was agreed upon. Maybe Chevy said "work together" but the merging of firms would have taken all the partners agreeing, no matter how small their shares ... unless Pete and Joan have so little, like 10% and 5% that they didn't have a say? I wonder.

Vincent, who plays Pete, has such a great look of the '70s/late '60s. He's still Pete, but is aging into the character. Not that Darrin Stevens type of the start of the show.

I like Kenny, but he was WRONG.

So glad there was no Harry or Mrs. Heart Doctor in this episode. Snore.

I thought when Mr. Jaguar's wife said "let's go powder our noses" we were going to cut to the three ladies in the lounge with Mrs. Jaguar revealing she speaks French and telling Megan's mother to shut up. But of course, she really was a wife of the late '60s with a stupid husband. I know Don is above squealing, but I wish Joan would send a letter to the wife. I like revenge. Of course, she wouldn't believe it, but Mr. Jaguar would be sweating. I did not get that Don fired them. How perfect, just before they got the shot at Chevy...

The Chevy Vega ... wasn't that car kind of a dork?
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Cosmocrush
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Quote:
 
Don ... "I did this wrong before" then tells Peggy 'congrats on your demotion' ... takes Ted to put a good spin on it.

I totally missed that "congrats on your demotion" part. I sometimes rewatch the last one before the new one so thanks Icy - something to catch this time around.

Even though my father is/was a 6'2" and wasn't built anything like Pete, his late sixties style reminds me sooo much of my Dad around that time. The hairline especially and the sideburns. Add in some black rimmed glasses and voila! My dad in 1968.
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Cosmocrush
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I found this on TW o P:


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They said a big theme for the season was people finding themselves back where they thought they'd left. Peggy had a big moment of that with Don. She's making her own way at this agency and was even contemplating a stupid but independent affair with Ted, and then here's Don to put her back in the same place again. Pete was on the verge of making a big deal that would make him independent and putting him back where he wanted to be and then he was back dealing with Daddy-in-law reminding him he only tolerates him because he's a toy his princess wanted for some reason.


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cccharley
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I didn't catch the demotion line either.

Interesting on the theme. The doors and windows theme continues. Lots of closing elevators.

I'm sure they spoke with the other partners of the firm before announcing the merger. Guess there was no reason to show that part as part of the show. It is an assumption. I don't think Chevy told them to work together. I think they went in and pitched together as a team and a larger firm. I thought that was the point. They were leaving the bar to go work on it all night. Just my opinion.

I don't think Don cared if he got Peggy back as an intrinsic part of the merger but it is a plus and he values her work and always has. Even if he has been an ass he did respect her work and gave her her first big break leaving the secretarial pool to an executive track job.

Peggy, to me, is very conflicted in many things in her life now - the boyfriend, the job etc. I'm also glad they are all back together. Peggy also had affairs with men in higher positions in the past so her past is coming back to the same if she pursues the kiss further with Ted. Remember that dumb affair with Dick to get ahead? She used to be enamored with men with power - although he was a dumb old drunk.

I looked up the Vega. It was hot but had problems. It lasted till 1977 and then production was ceased.
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weaver
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I don't think Don cared if he got Peggy back as an intrinsic part of the merger but it is a plus and he values her work and always has. Even if he has been an ass he did respect her work and gave her her first big break leaving the secretarial pool to an executive track job.


And don't forget, he kept the baby thing secret too.

He's glad to get her back, I'm sure. Remember when she made a pass at him and he said no? She's always been a conflicted character.

I think if they could go public as SCDP, they can go public as the new company (doubt they will, because that plot is probably over). With the bigger staff and CHEVROLET, who cares about Jaguar. Lost a car, got a car. They are going to need to replace Vicks though.

I saw the cast on Katie one day a few weeks ago and they were discussing what is the difference between Pete and Don. And they concluded Don is better looking and more charming. I pretty much agree.



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weaver
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I knew someone who lived on 16 West 76th Street in the early 70's. It was decent between CPW and Columbus. Between Columbus and Amsterdam, not so good. I just looked up the address and the house looks the same. All those houses were divided into rentals. THe era of buying them and restoring them as the beautiful homes they were was much later, in my judgement. People didn't live in the city when they had kids, they commuted, like Don and Pete. At some point people realized you could live in the city with kids. My neighborhood didn't have a kid in it until about 20 years ago, now you trip over strollers and day care centers everywhere you go.



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cccharley
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There were kids - most went private though if they were upper middle or above or to parochial. Public schools were horrid. Most of the best privates have been around for a long time. Middle class kids were able to attend as well - drs and lawyers were easily able to afford it. Not as easy right now nor with the competition for space. Definitely most moved out to the suburbs but there was always a core city group who had apts and summer houses. I actually have friends who were early 60s born and grew up on the UWS. They lived in that big complex *not the projects - near WEA and Riverside. It went Coop now and is very expensive but it was rental and cheap back then. I didn't see it till the mid 70s but they lived there since they were babies. Mom was a singer.
Edited by cccharley, May 8 2013, 11:58 AM.
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IcyAll
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Yeah, I know some people (in theater) who lived on the UWS from the late '50s on and raised their kids there. They said (I think it was) Aretha Franklin* lived in the neighborhood and wouldn't let her kids play with the white kids who lived up there because they were too poor. The woman who told me this had been in the Open Theater and was very pro Civil Rights, so it shocked her to have that come back at her. But she still lives there, though Aretha and her children have moved on ... and the woman's child has grown up, moved out to Long Island where she and her husband own a vineyard.

Quote:
 
I don't think Chevy told them to work together. I think they went in and pitched together as a team and a larger firm. I thought that was the point. They were leaving the bar to go work on it all night. Just my opinion.


As they were leaving the bar Don said "but we'll let them come up with the idea" or the other guy said it - but they were pulling the same stunt Megan and Don pulled with Mr. Heinz Beans when they led him to the idea of the same actress playing every Mom throughout time for the commercial -- let the client think they're the brilliant ones. Yes, they had the idea and worked on it, but they led Chevy to tell them to do it.



* Might have been Diana Ross.
Edited by IcyAll, May 8 2013, 01:01 PM.
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Mariah
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Yeah Icy, that's the impression I got as well.

Chevy was no match for Don, Roger, AND Ted. They outplayed them.
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weaver
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cccharley
May 8 2013, 11:51 AM
There were kids - most went private though if they were upper middle or above or to parochial. Public schools were horrid. Most of the best privates have been around for a long time. Middle class kids were able to attend as well - drs and lawyers were easily able to afford it. Not as easy right now nor with the competition for space. Definitely most moved out to the suburbs but there was always a core city group who had apts and summer houses. I actually have friends who were early 60s born and grew up on the UWS. They lived in that big complex *not the projects - near WEA and Riverside. It went Coop now and is very expensive but it was rental and cheap back then. I didn't see it till the mid 70s but they lived there since they were babies. Mom was a singer.
I know exactly where you mean. They built up those apts after Lincoln Center made the area more liveable. One of my college friends lived there, she grew up in Queens, and then her parents moved over there. Her father was something like a lawyer or doctor.

But I don't think any Peggy types were buying apartments in those days. That's my impression anyway. Peggy has had a good job for what, four years?

I dated someone from Dancer, Fitzgerald, and Sample back in the day. Made me laugh when it was mentioned.
Edited by weaver, May 8 2013, 01:35 PM.
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Mariah
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Peggy said something about tax lawyers telling her she needed to do something with her money.

Weaver, when my acquaintance/friend bought in the Haight, everyone thought he was nuts, and people were surprised there was anything for sale there--most of the houses had been chopped up into apartments, actually that was the hardest part of his restoration. He was pretty rich, and could have bought in a nicer area, but he loved that old Victorian.

He kicked out the renters, cleaned up the shit, and got started. I met him about 2-3 years into it, and by that time others were buying and fixing other old houses up. He told me he went ahead and bought it when a couple of gay executives he knew bought one. I remember him telling me, "When those kind of gays buy, you KNOW the neighborhood is going to turn around." So, he was in on the ground floor, so to speak, when no one else was doing it. Within 5 years prices had quadrupled even for the most run down fixers there. Baby strollers appeared soon after.

So, I'm just wondering, were there NO houses for sale at all in that NY neighborhood in the late 60's? I mean the boyfriend made it clear that "others are doing it." Even in an area of all renters there are some owners, at least in the West. The showrunner really seems to pay attention to most details like that.
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cccharley
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There were always places for sale but it wasn't safe in lots of parts so many didn't buy especially without doormen. The 80s brought the great coop conversions with insider pricing for renters. Now regarding kicking people out is a different issue. Still is to this day. There are rent stabilization and rent controlled laws (two different things btw) and you could not kick out the tenants even if you bought the townhouse. You had to wait till they died and nobody else was a cotenant on the lease. Many people were bought out but it's hard to get those tenants out and some still remain. You can google it
Edited by cccharley, May 8 2013, 02:03 PM.
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IcyAll
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Yes, CCC is right, very hard to dislodge tenants in NYC -- thank GOD! I kept my apartment for years while battling a stupid landlord who wanted me to move so he could double the rent.

The only fast way around that is to claim that you need the apartment for a relative and prove you have no other apartment space for them. If Peggy said her sister needed the place and the other apartments were full, the tenants would have to move.

Of course, this is FICTION, LOL. Vague references and we're filling in the blanks!


ETA: Thought this was interesting ... here's an old ad for the Chevy Vega:

Posted Image
Edited by IcyAll, May 8 2013, 04:02 PM.
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weaver
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So, I'm just wondering, were there NO houses for sale at all in that NY neighborhood in the late 60's? I mean the boyfriend made it clear that "others are doing it." Even in an area of all renters there are some owners, at least in the West. The showrunner really seems to pay attention to most details like that.


I'm sure there were, its just that the Peggy type of person didn't do it in my experience, even 10 years later. I knew several high level exec type women, they all rented. As ccc says, the great co-op conversion of old buildings happened in the 80's. I only had a vague idea of what a co-op was.

Well, Weiner got Le Cirque wrong, and he does get other things wrong.
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Mariah
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I understand, but Peggy didn't WANT to move there, she was buying a co-op. When her boyfriend said that thing about "I want our kids to grow up with more diversity." her eyes glazed over and she caved in to please him. She HATES it now, but I thought it was totally in keeping with both of their personalities, and especially since Peggy is paving new ground as one of the very few female executives at that time.

When push comes to shove, marriage and kids vs career is an issue women still face today, but Peggy is coping with it without a ton of books on the subject or multiple role models.
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