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Downton Abbey; Inheritances, Dowagers, Cads, oh, my!
Topic Started: Jan 10 2012, 06:29 PM (4,435 Views)
IcyAll
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Since this is a mini-series, I'd say it belongs here ...

Who is watching?
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Camo
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Oh, yes! I'm watching!

Who is everyone's least favorite character? Mine: Edith. It surprises me. I'm an underdog lover but ay yi yi, I cannot with Edith. The premiere did not change that at all.
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discomom
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I have off tomorrow.... I have a date with the remote and Downton Abbey. A cup of tea sounds great right now... I'm getting sick :(
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pixie
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I dislike O'Brien and Thomas the most. I'd find Edith more annoying if she made someone other than Mary her target. Those two deserve each other. And poor Edith is a product of an environment where women are valued for three things alone: beauty, position, and wealth.

I adore Sybil. She wants to actually be a person in her own right, no matter how difficult the task in the milieu in which she lives. But I need to rewatch series one because I've confused Sybil with another character from a different PBS series that I don't like and I can't remember where I crossed my wires.

**Spoiler**

I got frustrated when Bates gave into his wife's blackmail. Stop being a sucker, dude. His wife had no proof that Mary banged the dead Turkish diplomat. The rumor is already out. She had nothing, really. It seemed contrived to me. I did like that the housekeeper (?) listened at the vent.
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Momo
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I have one more episode of season 1 to watch and that's for nap time today. Squee!

And yeah, Thomas and O'Brien can go to hell. They truly suck.
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pixie
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burp
Excuse me.
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Momo
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Ok, I just watched the season 1 finale. How much do I hate the odious O'Brien for causing the Countess to miscarry just because she thought she was about to be replaced?

Please, please tell me that asshole Thomas really does go. The shit he said about the fetus Cora lost and the way he jabbed at William over the loss of his mother. I wanted to reach through the screen and cockpunch that self-satisfied smirk right off his face.

Season 2 on the DVR - watching tonight after the kiddies are in bed!
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Camo
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Quote:
 
I dislike O'Brien and Thomas the most. I'd find Edith more annoying if she made someone other than Mary her target. Those two deserve each other. And poor Edith is a product of an environment where women are valued for three things alone: beauty, position, and wealth.

I adore Sybil. She wants to actually be a person in her own right, no matter how difficult the task in the milieu in which she lives. But I need to rewatch series one because I've confused Sybil with another character from a different PBS series that I don't like and I can't remember where I crossed my wires.


I love watching but O'Brien and Thomas were very Snidely Whiplash as villains to me, season 1, so my emotions were more directed to other characters. I think the best actress of the sisters is the one in Mary's role, so I feel like I gravitate towards her. I agree that Edith's fate would *seem* to be in a danger zone, given her relative lack of beauty (at least that is what's presented and assumed) and her middle-child position, but Mary's isn't truly much better, since she chafes against what she must do in terms of marrying because of the entail all during season 1, and her affair with Kamal Pamuk isn't something she 100% freely chose. I mean, they flirted but you could see how Mary just wasn't in charge of what was going to occur once he roped Thomas into his plan, came into the room and started wheedling. Edith can't see that Mary is somewhat trapped, too.

I'm not super fond of the young actress playing Sybil -- she's sweet and pretty but there's something not gelling for me there.
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pixie
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Camo
Jan 11 2012, 07:08 PM
Quote:
 
I dislike O'Brien and Thomas the most. I'd find Edith more annoying if she made someone other than Mary her target. Those two deserve each other. And poor Edith is a product of an environment where women are valued for three things alone: beauty, position, and wealth.

I adore Sybil. She wants to actually be a person in her own right, no matter how difficult the task in the milieu in which she lives. But I need to rewatch series one because I've confused Sybil with another character from a different PBS series that I don't like and I can't remember where I crossed my wires.


I love watching but O'Brien and Thomas were very Snidely Whiplash as villains to me, season 1, so my emotions were more directed to other characters. I think the best actress of the sisters is the one in Mary's role, so I feel like I gravitate towards her. I agree that Edith's fate would *seem* to be in a danger zone, given her relative lack of beauty (at least that is what's presented and assumed) and her middle-child position, but Mary's isn't truly much better, since she chafes against what she must do in terms of marrying because of the entail all during season 1, and her affair with Kamal Pamuk isn't something she 100% freely chose. I mean, they flirted but you could see how Mary just wasn't in charge of what was going to occur once he roped Thomas into his plan, came into the room and started wheedling. Edith can't see that Mary is somewhat trapped, too.

I'm not super fond of the young actress playing Sybil -- she's sweet and pretty but there's something not gelling for me there.

Yes, there was something vaguely rapey about the Kamal Pamuk incident. But I think that, too, was a side-effect of the times in which they lived. It's one of the reasons I'm so uncomfortable with sex-shaming. When you make sex shameful for women then they have to pretend they don't want it even when they do want it in order to retain their "virtue" and the line between no-meaning-yes and sexual assault becomes blurry. In this case, I think Mary wanted to have sex as a means to rebellion and because he was exotic, sexy, and forbidden. The actress does a good job playing Mary.

I like the character of Sybil. I haven't thought much about the actress one way or another.

O'Brien and Thomas are completely stereotypical villains but I buy into the characters because there are people out there who take relatively trivial problems deadly seriously and will do anything they can to get what they want.

Was it me, or was Edith macking on a married dude? Bad form.
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Camo
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Dude was indeed married! I was like, Edith, NO!
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pixie
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Camo
Jan 11 2012, 09:26 PM
Dude was indeed married! I was like, Edith, NO!

And they weren't even subtle or clever about it. Right in front of the barn door, all perfectly backlit in the growing twilight. I thought I must have misunderstood and that it was his sister and not his wife because no one is that stupid.
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Momo
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BRING BACK BATES!!!

Poor, poor Anna.
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discomom
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pixie
Jan 12 2012, 02:39 AM
Camo
Jan 11 2012, 09:26 PM
Dude was indeed married!  I was like, Edith, NO!

And they weren't even subtle or clever about it. Right in front of the barn door, all perfectly backlit in the growing twilight. I thought I must have misunderstood and that it was his sister and not his wife because no one is that stupid.

Me, too!
My question is, if Edith is the "homely" one, why does she also have to be the despicable one? It goes back to the old standard of "the heroine is beautiful and the evil one ugly". In real life we all know people who are extremely good looking, but just nasty, and some who are not considered blessed with looks, but are beautiful because of their personality.


Poor Anna, indeed. I get that Bates is supposed to be honorable, but really! You know, if Bates' wife wants to run to the papers with the story about Mary, but yet Mary is all but engaged to a newspaper tycoon; Ummm...seems to me in those times, with their connections, those stories would be easily pulled from publication. Times were different then, and money/status could buy more. Look at all the Hollywood and political scandals that were covered up , and that was the 40' and 50's. I get that nothing should "taint" Mary's reputation, but the rumor was already out there, and Mr. Tycoon (I forgot his name already!) seems like the type who would overlook that. A self made man, and all.

Sorry for the analyzing, here I'm one who couldn't stand the analyzing of every single little thing on the RHoBH thread over there, and I'm doing it here. I'll shut up, sit down and sip my tea! ;)
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Momo
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Well, I know Bates shows back up because I looked up Downton Abbey on IMDB (I was looking up who played Rosamund - guess what! I know her from the Bond films as Monneypenny!) and it listed the actor who plays Bates as being in 16 episodes. We've seen him in 8 episodes so far, so he's in a lot more to come. Also, Maria Doyle Kennedy (Bates' wife) is in 2 episodes so we'll see her again, too. For me, this still means there's hope for Bates and Anna.

I wish Matthew and Mary would just stop pussyfooting around and get to the point and marry each other. I know that this was part of the era but I also know they're drawing it out for the dramatic effect and that wears on me. We spent all last season on this story line and now we must recapitulate it? Sigh.

Edith is just stupid. There's no other word for it - aside from, perhaps, spiteful. She does things without thinking of the ramifications of her actions just because she feels she's due some attention.
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discomom
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My mom knows Bates from another character he plays on Larkrise to Candleford. She doesn't know how he is going to "appear"on both, and no amount of my explaining will convince her that he isn't doing the 2 simultaneously...sigh...

You know, I was wondering about the Mary/Matthew?fiance (what is her name? I really do watch this show!) triangle. And I remembered the awful Spanish Influenza epidemic at the end of WWI. Which leads me to wonder:

Will Mary marry Mr. Tycoon and Matthew marry his girl, and there are some influenza deaths which then allow Matthew and Mary to hook up?

Will Matthew contract influenza and return to Downton Abbey to recuperate, and end up with Mary?(Kind of like Anne of Green Gables and Gilbert)

I totally agree with you, Momo. I'm tired of the pussyfooting around, as well.

I am fascinated with this era. My grandma lived with us and I was very close to her. She was a young(19 year old) newly married woman with a baby during this time. She had brothers who fought in WWI, a brother in law who died from the Spanish Flu, and used to always sing songs from that era. I have pictures of her dressed with the long skirts, her hair done up with a bow, and my grandpa all set to ride on his Harley (yes!) wearing a 3 piece suit and tie. While I'm glad that we have moved ahead on many issues, I do miss a certain gentility, or concern for others that we seem to be missing today.
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