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The Game From Start To Finish; To Steal Brobst's Title
Topic Started: Jan 5 2017, 11:25 PM (554 Views)
Michael Myers
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1/25/17

2:50 pm est

It's time to start thinking about the future.

Assuming that Clubber goes tomorrow night, which at the moment, still seems to be the case, we'd get to ten with my voting block still completely in tact. And of course, the five in my core have also added Freddy and Inigo into the fold. Plus, Rocky, Luke, and Darth would all be looking to find a way in.

The assumption is Luke would go next, and I'm actually all for that. It would be an easy next vote, and it would further my position. It's the round after that I think a move would be made. Jason is already talking about maybe trying to work with Rocky and Darth at that point. And that is certainly an option. He is scared the others in our original block might want to split us up when those guys are gone, so I guess it would be a sort of preemptive strike.

If he wants the target to be Inigo, I might be down for that. If he tries to target Superman or Miyagi, I will be way less down. And in fact, at that point, it might be time for me to make MY next big move, and just vote out Jason Vorhees.

I think, at the moment, I see my best path to the end as being with Miyagi and Superman. But that could change. I'm still keeping my options open.

So right now, I see the next three votes as being Clubber, Luke, and then either Inigo or Jason... depending on the circumstances.
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Michael Myers
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1/26/17

1:50 am est

Jason is moving way faster than I predicted and in ways I don't like. He agrees with me that we need to vote out Clubber and then Luke. But after that, he wants to work with Darth Vader. Of course, I was already thinking about making a move that round, and including Darth on it. The problem is my move would have taken out Inigo. His move would somehow INCLUDE Inigo... and Rocky. So, process of elimination tells us that he'd be targeting someone that's been voting with us all along at that point. I don't think he'd target Indiana or Freddy. And I don't think he'd go for Miyagi right away, because when I questioned him he said maybe there's a way to get Miyagi in on it. That leads me to believe he'll target Superman.

I'm assuming he's thinking about these things because the things Clubber has said about him have seeped into his brain. I'm sure he's paranoid that people really will try to "dethrone the king." What he doesn't realize is, I am probably going to be one of those people, because now he is making moves against people I want to work with, and I can't have that.

What is really confusing me is why he is including both Rocky and Inigo in the group, and he's not really including Freddy at all. I feel like he is moving faster than I am to get in tighter with the other side, and I'm wondering if any of it has to do with his involvement with the bigger alliance beforehand. I've always known he's been more popular than I have in this game. And this could be the part where I just have to put a stop to that. But yeah, the impression that I've been getting is that Inigo is fairly tight with Miyagi. But now, it's starting to seem like he's tighter with Jason, and I don't like that. Inigo couldn't wait to take out Clubber, but Jason thinks he'll suddenly be willing to go right to work with Darth Vader? He seems to know something I don't know.

It's also funny that I heard his plan from Darth Vader before I even heard it from him. I have to be careful how I respond to this situation. I'm 90% sure it's about time to get Jason out of this game. Clubber has to go first, obviously. But do I take Jason out even before Luke now? I'm starting to think about it. He still has that damn reward, thanks to Jaws quitting. I don't know what I should say to Miyagi about this, but if I explain to him how dire this situation could really be for him, I'm sure he'll work with me to fix it. I just hope he doesn't tell anything to Inigo... because Inigo might just rat us out to the other side. Inigo is now the wildcard.

At any rate, something is in the works in my brain, and that isn't necessarily a good thing for Jason, because if I get my way, Jason's life in this game is coming to an end within the next couple rounds.
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Michael Myers
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1/27/17

12:35 am est

Boy o boy do I hope the next round is some sort of machete rope chop type thing so we can ensure Luke doesn't win immunity. I just want one more quiet round before I have to show my cards.

Jason and Darth seem all about working together now. The plan appears to be that me, Jason, Darth, Rocky, and Inigo would all work together moving forward. Of course Jason also claims he still wants to work with the others. That's IMPOSSIBLE. The thing with Jason is he wants everyone to like him, and I'm over that nonsense. He's trying to move in a direction that messes up the alliance I've been cultivating between me, Miyagi, and Superman, so I must step in and stop him.

I've initiated sabotage mode. Miyagi and Superman have both now been informed that Jason is planning on flipping after Luke is gone. I am going to suggest to both of them that we vote out Luke as scheduled, pretending everything is ok, but then the next round? WE STRIKE. And if it were up to me, we'd be striking none other than "King Jason" himself (thanks for the name, Mr. Tea).

I've also been in espionage mode... trying to get to the bottom of the relationships Inigo has in this game, and I really am starting to believe he'd be more comfortable working with me, Miyagi, and Superman than Jason, Rocky, and Darth... especially since Darth was going to vote him out on Cobra Kai and he isn't so sure that Rocky wasn't just going to go along with it. So I had a nice conversation with him and we came to the conclusion that, together, we will be swing votes at F9. We can either vote with Jason's crew or we can vote with what I call Miyagi's crew (though it's really equally mine... I'm no swing). I want it to seem like we are deciding which way to go together, but make no doubt about it, I will do everything in my power to make sure "we" decide to vote Jason out.

On a side note, I have no idea where Freddy stands in ANY of this. His behavior today was odd. Was he really trying to target Jason? Was he really just trying to get people to think we aren't close to him (that's what he tells us)? Was he really trying to get Jason to waste his reward (I'm glad he did, actually)? Was he really just trying to test Clubber (also what he told me)? Is he really tighter to me or to Jason or to both of us or to neither of us or to Miyagi? The dude is crazy. I can't figure him into my plans at the moment, because he's shown he is a chaos player.

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Michael Myers
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Superman is showing me a surprising amount of loyalty toward Jason, who doesn't give a rat's ass about Superman. I just told him the guy is planning on probably turning on him, and let's be real here, the first target would most likely be... SUPERMAN. And instead of being all about striking first, he wants me just to help Jason realize it would be smarter to stick with his original group.

He doesn't understand why Jason would want to flip. The thing is, I think I do. I think Jason always had a bond with Darth Vader. He was on Clubber's list. He was always a name that came up as someone people liked. Jason, while he's been on our side, is NOT one of the under the radar players like Superman or Miyagi, or even (to a degree, though not nearly as much) myself. He is one of the VISIBLE players. He's one of the most sociable players here. And he doesn't trust people like Superman or Miyagi or Indiana not to flip on him, because he knows they know he's a threat. So it makes sense for him to start voting with the other threats, to use them as shields, or so they can mutually protect each other. It also makes sense that he'd want to go with the player that talks to him way more... that gives him more than a few short sentences, or that sends him more than just one message right before tribal council to see who the vote is for. That gives you more of a sense of certainty with the people you are communicating with.

Plain and simple, Jason prefers to work with Darth Vader for those reasons. Yes, like Superman pointed out, he'd just be going from one group of five to another. But, and this is why I don't like it, in this new group of five, he'd have more room to CUT ME out down the road and make a final push with Darth or Rocky. He's probably scared that, in our group, maybe he I'll be the one to make a move, or maybe Miyagi would. He sees it as a more unsure path, because there are too many wildcards, because too many people do a bad job of communicating with him (other than myself).

I just have to make Superman realize, that no matter what the reason, whether it makes sense or not, Jason is thinking about flipping; and more than just thinking about it, he's really leaning in that direction right now. It doesn't have to make sense to Superman for it to be real. And it doesn't have to make sense to Superman for it to make sense to Jason either.
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BROBST
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ALWAYS INFORMATIVE, MR. MYERS. :ph43r:
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Michael Myers
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Well, I just laid out for Miyagi exactly how I would prefer for the rest of this game to go, and it was completely, 100% sincere.

I want Luke to go next. Then Jason (ok, it might not have been a HUNDRED percent sincere, since I said it depended on Jason's behavior, but I'm trying to sabotage Jason so hard right now, I want him gone after Luke, REGARDLESS). Then Rocky, Darth, and Freddy. Though the order of those three really doesn't matter to me, and in reality, we should take into account which ones we think are bigger challenge threats.

Then final five would be me, Miyagi, Superman, Indiana, and Inigo.

We could either take Indiana or Inigo to four, I really could care less... except, again, we should probably base it on challenge prowess, but we could also base it on the fact that Indiana just might not deserve final four based on how little he actually does in the game. Or we could do the opposite and base it on loyalty to Indiana for being with us longer. So, it's really up in the air.

Final three would be me, Miyagi, and Superman. And then if either of me or Miyagi win last immunity, we take the other one.

As of right now, I'm even sincere about that last part. I know Superman is the goat in this game, but I think I could probably beat both of them. Miyagi will be a much tougher opponent, but it would be more fun.

So yeah, sincere for now. The competitor in me might change my mind at the last moment though and take Superman. :lol:

But all of this is just my PERFECT vision. It probably won't happen this way.
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Michael Myers
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1/27/17

11:30 pm est

Things are getting interesting. Now both Inigo and Jason are talking about holding off on a big move until 8. They both suggest that we vote Luke out next. And then they both suggest we vote out Freddy at 9. They both see this as the path of least resistance.

Here's the thing. I've set it up with both of them so that the perception is we are the swing votes. Jason thinks that me and him are the swing votes. Inigo thinks that me and him are the swing votes. That's IF they aren't just playing me and are really in cahoots, which is possible. The point here is, they both think that voting out two people that aren't affiliated with a "side" will allow us to hold our cards closer to our chests for longer. Then we don't have to worry about scrambling from the side we don't vote with.

That only works out for me if I really AM in the swing position with one or both of them. If they are actually in cahoots, and I allow them to take out Freddy, then we could suddenly be looking at a very different game where I can lose control very fast.

Now, Freddy is talking about how there are two times to make a big move in the game... at 9 and at 7. That kind of thinking is super antiquated. You an make a big move whenever you want, as long as it works in your favor. I've made moves on even numbered rounds plenty of times. Regardless, Freddy sees Jason as being a big threat, and he realizes I'm going to have to make a big move against him at some point because I'm perceived as a "follower." I don't need him to tell me I need to make a move against Jason. I already know that.

The thing is, I'm not sure if he'll want to make a move against Jason right now or a move WITH Jason, because he also called Jason a "loyal solider," which is far from the truth. And he said that Jason will be targeted but that so will I once Jason is gone I obviously can't tell him I'm in the alliance I am in. Then he won't vote with me anyway. But I have to get him to want to vote Jason out after Luke.

Luckily for me, Jason wants to target Freddy next, but I can't tell Freddy that yet, because he's too much of a loose cannon, and I don't want his loose lips sinking my ship. So, I have to keep quiet for now and figure this out some other way.
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Michael Myers
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O, to hell with it. I just told Freddy Jason is thinking about voting him out after Luke. Let's see how fun the game gets now. :lol:
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BROBST
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Michael Myers,Jan 27 2017
10:41:37 PM

O, to hell with it. I just told Freddy Jason is thinking about voting him out after Luke. Let's see how fun the game gets now. :lol:


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Michael Myers
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Aaaaaaaaaaannnnndddd....

Freddy said he's down to vote Luke out next followed by Jason. :ph43r:

Now I'm discussing with Miyagi that maybe the two of us should offer Freddy some kind of deal, just to keep him feeling comfortable... to keep him in line.

I've been playing up the savior card with him all game. I protected him on Chianti, got the vote off of him and onto Ghostface. Here, I'm saving him again. I want him to think I have his back more than anyone else does.
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Michael Myers
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I'm trying SOOOO hard to play match maker between Miyagi and Freddy here. :lol:

If I can get those two on the same page, I'm in an AMAZING spot in this game. But it's not an easy chore. They certainly are skeptical of each other.

At least I have them messaging each other right now.

The two of them could really be good for each other's games as well here, because nobody expects them to be working together. And I mean, a voting block is a voting block. But I guess Miyagi is scared that Freddy is a loose cannon and Freddy is scared that Miyagi has all these alliances.

I find it funny that everyone just assumes Miyagi is the ringleader of Indiana, Superman, and Inigo. Nobody thinks I'm involved there??? Either way, I want them to get tighter, and I'm trying my hardest... if only because I want to blindside Jason SO BAD at F9.
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Michael Myers
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I'm pretty sure Miyagi thinks I'm moving too fast. I can tell he doesn't like that I told Freddy that Jason planned to vote for him after Luke. But I don't really care, because it ended up being good for Miyagi anyway. I think Miyagi is moving too slow. When other people are making moves around you, you have to be ready to counter. He doesn't want me to tell Indiana anything.

Meanwhile, he is afraid that Indiana might have something with Inigo and Rocky. Well, if he does, and I don't tell him anything, he's just going to keep getting closer to them. That's the thing. That's how you get people to work with you. YOU DEAL INFORMATION TO THEM.

Indiana has been waiting for me to have a long strategic talk with him for ROUNDS now. I was on GREAT terms with Indiana on Skywalker, because I was able to provide him with great information and make moves with him. It seemed like we were working TOGETHER.

The longer Miyagi and I have these in-depth strategy discussions without him, the longer we leave him out of the loop, the less our "bond" sticks in his head, and I don't intend to lose Indiana because Miyagi wants to play things safe all the time.

Miyagi also doesn't want me bringing Inigo's name up at all as part of Jason's alliance, because he says we don't know for sure that Inigo is against us yet. He says that if we keep throwing his name out there, we will turn him against us. The thing is, I've never told ANYONE that Inigo is against us. I've only said that JASON plans to work with Inigo when he flips. That doesn't mean Inigo is going to actually work with Jason. I'm talking about Jason's plans, not Inigo's plans. There's a huge difference, and if someone is my ally, I should be able to have a free flowing conversation with them about what is going on with tribe dynamics so that we can best figure out how to respond.

Miyagi just wants to keep everything a secret from everyone all the time, but right now things are happening, and communication is a must. So now, he's probably annoyed at me, and I'm annoyed at him. Because our styles are different.

Maybe I should have just stuck with Jason and decided to flip. But it's too late now. I've done too much. If I stick with Jason's side, I'll be thrown under the bus hard.

I still want Jason out. But now I have to start watching out for Miyagi too.

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Michael Myers
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The bottom line... we need to rely on this voting block...

Me, Miyagi, Superman, Indiana... so ALL of us should be on the same page.

Plus, we now have Freddy's support, thanks to me. I don't know that Miyagi trusts that... but he seems to want me to trust Inigo, so it's a two way street. And the funny thing is he doesn't even trust Inigo... OR Indiana.

That's why he wants to keep everything secret all the time. He plays based on trust, and he trusts few people. He's always trying to get information FROM people, but he rarely likes to GIVE information. That's also why several people in the game do not trust him, and probably one of the reasons Jason wants to flip.

Me? I LOVE to give information. That's how I manipulate things. And of course, I don't trust anyone either, but then again, that doesn't very much matter to me, because I look at what's in someone's best interest... strategically, diplomatically, or just psychologically... and I trust that they'll make the moves they perceive to be best for them. And by the way, you can still read chaos players to a degree using that method. It's the "psychologically" part. Sometimes people don't make the move that is ACTUALLY best for them, if the goal is to win. You have to look at their motivations. Sometimes they do what is best for their ego or what is best for their sympathies, or what is best for their sense of vengeance, or whatever it might be. Some people NEED to satisfy their emotions, and so that's what they are interested in from a psychological standpoint. Their goals aren't the same as mine, but if I can learn their behavior patterns, I can still read them and predict their moves to a degree.

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BROBST
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Michael Myers,Jan 28 2017
12:49:02 AM
Sometimes people don't make the move that is ACTUALLY best for them, if the goal is to win.  You have to look at their motivations.  Sometimes they do what is best for their ego or what is best for their sympathies, or what is best for their sense of vengeance, or whatever it might be.  Some people NEED to satisfy their emotions, and so that's what they are interested in from a psychological standpoint.

That's a very good description of Chaos Players right there.
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Michael Myers
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Well, I have a very promising message from Inigo saying that he definitely feels more comfortable working with the Miyagi camp than the Jason camp. He also said that he'd be fine making a big move at F9, and that he only suggested voting Freddy out because he thought it would give us one more round before we had to show our cards. Personally, I'm ok with showing my cards. We'll only be showing them to Darth and Rocky at that point.

But I kind of also just want to protect Freddy.

However, we do have two options if Inigo really is with us. We could make our move at F9, like I want to, or we could put it off until F8, and vote Freddy out first. That would kind of suck for me, because I think Freddy is really loyal to me, but if it's the only way to keep everyone calm, cool, and collective, I'd go with it.

With Miyagi telling me to, basically, slow down, and Inigo's message sounding slightly like he feels the need to reassure me, I think I do have to take a back seat a bit. I'm hoping that I put in enough work tonight that Miyagi won't want to vote Freddy out now, since I got the two of them talking at least, and he knows Freddy plans to vote with us. Maybe that'll be enough to do the trick on it's own.

Otherwise, F9 is either going to be Freddy or Jason. But if it is Freddy, I sure as hell will do everything in my power to make sure it's Jason at F8.
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