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The Game From Start To Finish; To Steal Brobst's Title
Topic Started: Jan 5 2017, 11:25 PM (553 Views)
Michael Myers
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1/28/17

11:30 pm est

Now, Jason seems to be really playing the middle even more. He doesn't even seem to be saying he wants to work with Darth anymore. He just doesn't seem to know which side he wants to work with. I think he's scared that both sides will team up to come after us. But honestly, I think a lot of the paranoia is coming from things Clubber said about him. None of the Skywalker core was ever going to go after him until I told them he was thinking about flipping.

But this presents me with a problem, because now he is thinking about the two of us approaching the Skywalker core and warning them that Darth and Rocky approached us with a deal. I obviously already warned them about this. So I had to send a message to Miyagi letting him know this transformation has occurred. I haven't said anything to Superman yet, because Superman knows a lot less that Miyagi does anyway, and Superman has been HOPING Jason would flip back, so this will be good news to him.

Bottom line is Jason might be saving himself here. If he ultimately chooses not to flip, I might not be able to take him out when I want to. He doesn't realize it, but this could be a major turning point in his game.

And if he does decide not to flip, it could be bad for Freddy, because while I don't want to vote Freddy out, I have him ready to make a big move against Jason. If we suddenly ask him to vote for Darth or Rocky instead, he will get suspicious and blow up my spot. So, the better move at that point might be to just blindside Freddy after Luke.

I'm kind of still hoping that Jason ultimately decides to flip. That way, things can keep going according to the plan I've been working on.

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Michael Myers
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1/29/17

8:30 pm est

Darth tried to make a play, but I hopefully shut it down. He came to both me and Freddy and offered to make a move to take out Indiana Jones. His pitch was that both Inigo and Jason have expressed interest in voting Freddy out after Luke, which he claims means they are aligned and are going to vote with Miyagi, Superman, and Indiana after this week to take us all out. The thing is, that's just not going to happen. Jason just wants to vote Freddy out to buy him a round of still playing the middle. And Inigo, I think, just doesn't trust Freddy.

At any rate, I pretty much made it clear that I am still voting Luke tonight, so Darth seems to have backed off.

Meanwhile, Indiana finally logged back in. He apparently went to Miyagi and said he wants to put together a group of five. He suggested some of the "less active players." I wonder why... maybe because he might as well NOT BE PLAYING at this point. But yeah, those players included himself, Miyagi (not active my ass), Superman, and Inigo (again, not active my ass). He asked Miyagi who a good fifth would be. Interesting. So, because I'm too active in the game, and not someone who only logs in every three days like him, I am no longer part of the party? I'll remember that, Indiana.

At any rate, I filled Indiana in on the things that have been going on with Jason, so I'm pretty sure with that, combined with just the fact that those people are already working with me, I'll end up being the fifth. But I'll have to keep an eye on that, because I don't want to ACTUALLY be sitting fifth.

The unfortunate part is I told Indiana that Miyagi didn't want me to tell him about the Jason thing, because he was worried Indiana might be closer to Inigo or Rocky than we thought, so I asked him to keep it between us for now. That could either build "trust" between us, or he could just go and betray my trust now, screwing me over. If I see any signs that I will lose control of that side of the game, I WILL just flip with Jason and vote with Rocky and Darth. Freddy will vote with me, I'm pretty sure.
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Michael Myers
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1/30/17

12:05 am est

Now that Luke is gone, things get more interesting. This is the round everyone has been waiting for... the round where the pre-determined early votes are all out of the way. Now people want to make moves.

But I've already been busy setting possible moves up in my favor. I still want to vote Jason out next, but it isn't entirely up to me. In fact, it's largely up to Jason, himself.

First of all, I have Inigo in a very logical, strategic discussion with me, looking at our mutual options from the middle. And to be honest, I like the way that discussion is going. I also have Miyagi talking over all of our options and I have Freddy looking over all of our options. I still have Jason telling me everything. I could call myself a "pair" with multiple people here. With that kind of play comes a lot of control, but it's also dangerous, because if the wrong people compare notes, I could get myself in trouble. As of now, I seem to be ok.

Right now, Jason is starting to really not trust his relationship with Darth Vader, because I straight up told him Vader tried to save Luke today behind his back and threw him under the bus, speculating to me that he has an alliance with Inigo and Miyagi. Obviously, that didn't make Jason too happy. Now, I think Jason is POSSIBLY thinking about voting Darth out and just sticking with the Skywalkers. But I also think he's equally considering voting out Superman or Indiana to prove his loyalty to Darth instead.

He has a strange fascination with Darth. I think he's scared to death of him. But he won't simply vote him out to fix that. Instead, it's almost like he's seeking approval. Part of it is I think he is also terrified of Miyagi on the other side, but same thing... he won't target Miyagi, just Miyagi's allies. I'm not a fan of Jason's thought process right now. He wants to play the middle for as long as he can. BUT HE'S NOT IN THE MIDDLE. I am. :ph43r:

I got a message from Luke on his way out asking me to do him a favor and "not let Jason win." Well, I'm working on that, buddy. :)

In the meantime, Superman is a loyal guy. Right now, he sees Rocky, Darth, and Jason as threats, but he wants to go after Darth Vader first. And I get it. I think he still holds onto hope that Jason will come around. Plus, last Superman heard, Jason was going after Freddy next anyway. But that isn't happening now; because of Darth Vader, Jason will either be targeting Darth himself or he'll be targeting Superman or Indiana to prove himself to Darth. So, there you have it.

If Jason targets Darth Vader, and that is already how Superman wants to vote, Darth Vader is pretty much a goner. If Jason targets Superman or Indiana, and we tell him that, I WILL swing this thing and get Jason out of the game. :ph43r: I think Inigo pretty much agrees with me, and Miyagi will too, most likely. Indiana will vote however we vote, since that is his pattern (and he has now agreed to our final five and thinks he even set it up :rolleyes: ).

The only wildcard is Freddy. I HAVE to keep Freddy on my side. Because he could be the ace up my sleeve in this game down the line if I have to make a quick move to assure I won't just be a fifth wheel.
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BROBST
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Michael Myers,Jan 29 2017
11:05:31 PM

This is the round everyone has been waiting for...


Curious your thoughts about this, as it ends up being crucial in games more often than not.

Can't (obviously) say whether that's the case this season, but I'm always curious why some tend to overlook the F9 round.
Lots of players come into games thinking WAY ahead to what they want to do at F5, 4, 3. Maybe some type of plan for F7.

But why is F9 sometimes an overlooked round?

Not sure I've ever even heard many strategists over the years even discuss the ramifications of F9.

And everyone always talks about how key times to flip are at 7 and 5.

Is F9 the "red-headed stepchild" of a round? :lol:


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Michael Myers
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I've always said I'll make a move ANY round. Even numbered, odd numbered, low numbered, high numbered. It doesn't matter what "conventional wisdom" says. To me, each game is its own individual entity with its own particular set of circumstances and potentials, and you have to treat it as such. So instead of saying, "it's too early to make a move because that's just how the game is played," one should say "it's the wrong time to make a move because it would trigger X, Y, and Z." Cause and effect. Everything should be based on potential risks and rewards... repercussions. It's all about getting desired results to set you UP for those later rounds that you mentioned, at which point you can and should make FURTHER moves.

Every vote is a move. Sometimes, playing it safe is a good idea; other times, it's not. But that shouldn't be based on what round it is. It should be based on what is happening in the game DURING that round. In a game with 20 players, the 2 (provided it's a final 2) players that make it to the end will have made 18 moves along the way... some big some small.

Several players have used the term "too early" to me in this game already. One of them is Luke, and I'm sure he wishes he had made a bigger move WAY earlier. The ramifications of NOT making an early move can hurt you just as much.
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Michael Myers
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Also, I tend to make bigger moves earlier than some others because I like to make preemptive strikes. :ph43r:

The best defense is a strong offense in this game.
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BROBST
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Michael Myers,Jan 29 2017
11:52:33 PM
I've always said I'll make a move ANY round. Even numbered, odd numbered, low numbered, high numbered. It doesn't matter what "conventional wisdom" says. To me, each game is its own individual entity with its own particular set of circumstances and potentials, and you have to treat it as such. So instead of saying, "it's too early to make a move because that's just how the game is played," one should say "it's the wrong time to make a move because it would trigger X, Y, and Z." Cause and effect. Everything should be based on potential risks and rewards... repercussions. It's all about getting desired results to set you UP for those later rounds that you mentioned, at which point you can and should make FURTHER moves.

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Michael Myers
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Here's the other option... and I'm going to sleep on this.

Superman is so loyal, it's hard to get him to make moves with me, which makes him not as good of an ally to someone that is big on maneuvering a lot. Miyagi is a dangerous player, because he's super smart and super respected, and if I get to the end with him, he might just beat me, but at the same time, I don't know he'd even take me to the end with him anyway. And now that Indiana is talking about making the final five him, Miyagi, Superman, and Inigo with me as the fifth, that doesn't make me too comfortable either.

Jason is a HUGE player and I know I can't beat him. I also happen to think I'm outplaying him right now, but the jury doesn't know that. They can't see what I'm doing behind the scenes. Only Miyagi and Inigo see the full gist of it, and that might be enough for them to vote me out down the line, seeing me as a threat.

So maybe I'm on the wrong side of things... not that I want to keep Jason around. But maybe I need to look at it from a completely different angle all together.

We could vote WITH Rocky and Darth this round. Me, Rocky, Darth, Jason, and Freddy. But maybe I could convince them to go BIG with it instead of targeting Superman or Indiana. Maybe I could take Miyagi out NEXT.

Then, at eight, we could make a really interesting move. Superman, Indiana, and Inigo would be completely outnumbered. We could tell Jason to vote for one of them. Maybe Inigo, since he wants Inigo out of the game. Those three vote for whoever they want. Jason votes for Inigo. Four votes send Jason packing.

Now, that would take BOTH of the two biggest threats in the game out two rounds in a row.

If I wanted to pursue this, I'd have to basically have a long chat with three people... Rocky, Darth Vader, and Freddy. And I'd have to be sure they'd be down for it.

But after that, we could have final four easy. And it would make the game so interesting it would be ridiculous.
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Michael Myers
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I just sent this to Freddy. We'll see how he responds. It's always like playing Russian Roulette when you trust him with ANY information let alone something like this. :lol: :lol: :lol:

But I'm getting to that point where I just want to have fun with this game.

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Ok, this might be too crazy to pull off. It might be stupid. Or it might just not be something we want to do. But I've been thinking about ways to maneuver in the game to actually help us both out. Jason is all over the place, and he's hands down going to win if he makes it to the end. People see him as the big power, even though he's really not, and we've known his entire thought process the entire time. Taking him out sounds really appealing to me, but maybe it's not the right time.

Because on the other side, Indiana just offered Miyagi a final five alliance of Indiana, Miyagi, Superman, me, and Inigo. I was originally not included, but was "brought in" as the fifth. I certainly don't want to be sitting fifth. And you aren't even included in that. So it's not really an ideal situation. Of course, we'd have plenty of time to try to change things up.

But, I guess what I'm getting at is Miyagi is a pretty big threat too. Everyone loves him. Everyone respects him. Some even fear him. And if he gets to the end, he also wins.

You had said something about making big moves earlier. How does this sound?

For this coming round, we work with Darth, Rocky, and Jason, that gives us majority, and we convince them to go for the head of the snake on the other tribe. We take out Miyagi. Then the next round, Superman, Inigo, and Indiana will have no power. They can vote for whoever they want and it won't matter. We can tell Jason the vote is for one of them. So that's 3 votes for one of us, 1 vote for one of them. And then you, me, Darth, and Rocky can vote Jason out.

Boom both of the major threats gone in two rounds.

Now, a lot of things would have to go right in order for this to happen. Like, we'd have to be able to convince Darth and Rocky to go along with it without them ratting us out... although it would guarantee them final four (or at least we could promise them that). Also, after Miyagi goes, the others can rat me out to Jason to try to get him on their side, but the best they'd have then is a tie. I could try to explain it away.

At any rate, it's just a radical idea. It's probably not worth pursuing. But I was just trying to think of a path that would get us BOTH to the final four while taking out big threats and making the game interesting.

And not to mention, you are the only player I can come to with such a crazy plan and trust that you won't go spreading it around, which is why I have fun playing with you.
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BROBST
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Michael Myers
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1/30/17

11:55 pm est

Major things are in the works. Jason started targeting Freddy AGAIN today. Like, come ON man, STOP PLAYING THE MIDDLE. He just doesn't want to choose a side, but he doesn't realize that in targeting Freddy he IS choosing a side, because he's giving control to the Skywalkers.

And because he was targeting Freddy, Miyagi now also just wants to take out Freddy. Why not? Easy vote. Secures his majority pretty much to the end at that point. This round is PIVOTAL for anyone that doesn't want Miyagi to just walk to the end of this game and win.

As it turns out, according to Rocky, Miyagi, Indiana, and Inigo are super tight and offered him a final four all Stallion deal, which is why he was basically not too concerned about any of his Clubber allies getting voted out, and why I'm assuming he just stuck with small talk and told people he was a "free agent." But since Clubber got voted out, they stopped talking to him. Interestingly enough, that was right around the time I told them that Jason, Rocky, and Darth were working together, so I wonder if what I told them affected how they viewed him.

At any rate, I do not want to sit around and become fifth wheel to those three, and Superman won't make any big moves because he is too naive and wants to believe it's Skywalker til the end. :rolleyes:

So I want to take Miyagi out NOW. THIS ROUND. I have Freddy on board. I have Rocky on board. I have Darth Vader on board. The only other person I need on board is Jason. And he is freaking out.

He didn't want to do it. He just wanted to vote out Freddy and make both sides happy, because he's turned into a wuss. What happened to that great bold player that blindsided Hannibal with me??? And Bastian??? Where did HE go? I think the stuff Clubber said about him really got under his skin. Now, he's cowering in the corner and he doesn't want to make ANY moves.

So I had to tell him that I was offered the final five alliance by Miyagi, that he is not a part of, and now he is throwing himself a pity party. Nobody likes him. Nobody respects him. Freddy hates him. Well, YOU ARE THE ONE THAT KEEPS TARGETING FREDDY FOR NO OTHER REASON OTHER THAN TO NOT PISS OFF OTHER PEOPLE. Freddy has been LOYAL to Jason.

I'm over Jason. I want Jason out of this game. But I NEED him... just for this ONE ROUND.

Right now, he says he is going along with the plan to vote out Miyagi. But I have to keep my fingers crossed that he doesn't change his mind before tomorrow night. And I REALLY have to hope he doesn't open his mouth and say the wrong thing to ANYONE on Miyagi's side of things. If he tries to warn Superman or Indiana, he is an idiot.
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Michael Myers
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Well, Jason seems to have calmed down. He seems to be 100% on board so...

Miyagi is marked for assassination.

Of course, I will be scared to death tomorrow night until I see his face pop up in the video, because I worked HARD this round to make this happen, and if anything goes wrong between now and tomorrow night, it might be MY face popping up instead. :lol:

But that's the price to pay when you are basically playing ALL SIDES AT ONCE. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'm having a blast though.

O, and Miyagi needs to not win immunity, or things will go south fast. :o
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Michael Myers
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1/31/17

8:30 pm est

I know that I need Jason on my side still after this round, otherwise we could be looking at a tie. So I started talking to Superman about possibly having a final three deal with us and Jason. He seemed to like this idea and he even told me that he thinks Miyagi is dangerous, but that we should wait until next round to do something about it... by taking out Inigo.

Now, I do want to take Inigo out next round, so that is perfect. The problem is, I can't very well tell Superman that we are voting Miyagi out TONIGHT. So, I'm not sure how to handle that moving forward. Superman is still going to need allies, so I'm hoping he'll still realize he needs us. I'm hoping I can explain to him that we were just acting to prevent Miyagi and Inigo from having control of the game. And maybe he'll stick with us and help be the glue between me and Jason...

...because I'm pretty sure Inigo and Indiana will rat me out to Jason that I tried to flip on him and even target him for several days. They'll try to pit us against each other to save themselves, because that will be their only play.

Now, would Jason force the tie if I'm still working with him? Would he just flat out not trust me anymore? Freddy SEEMS to want final three to be the three remaining Chiantis. That could also act as glue, though Jason doesn't necessarily trust Freddy.

The next round is going to be tricky.

But it's like I told Darth. If Jason does flip on us, I doubt the other three will go to rocks to protect HIM, so we could probably vote Jason out at that point, and I wouldn't be opposed to it.
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Michael Myers
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2/1/17

2:10 am est

Bye Bye MIYAGI

So yeah, that went without a hitch. And I can't believe I won that immunity!!! :lol: That's like the first time I've won individual immunity since Allstars? And that was with other players helping me. :lol: :lol: :lol: Silly open ID games.

Anyway, this opens the game up a bit now. It also puts a bigger target on my back because there is no mistaking the fact that this move originated in me and Jason. And people still see us as a pair. Of course, this was MY move. Jason was originally fine with staying with the Skywalkers, until I told him about the final five alliance he wasn't in. And even then, he was going to settle for voting out Indiana. I pushed everyone to vote Miyagi. With this move and the Hannibal move both at my disposal, I can make a pretty good case for winning if I make it to the end.

But I think players in the game know that. So, for now, I'd like the perception to still be that the moves belong to BOTH of us. If any pair splitting happens, I want to make sure Jason takes the hit. In fact, I still want to vote him out at some point, both to remove that stigma, and to increase my chances of winning in the end (voting out "King Jason" will also get jury points).

I don't know if I can realistically make it to the end though. I've been in the middle too long. I LOVE being in the middle... but not for this long. It just takes away any sort of chance of you not being seen as a threat. But I'm kind of just stuck in the middle and will be again this round, because the people we just blindsided need to find a way back in and are coming to us.

Indiana is just kind of playing it cool. He basically said that he doesn't know where he stands now that he got lied to by people he thought were in his voting group. But he said he'd still work with us 100% and he hopes we can still be Skywalker strong until the end. Good answer. I won't believe it until Inigo is gone though. Either way, he's around so little, he might have little choice but to still try to stick with us.

Superman also claims he still wants to work with me and Jason, but his feelings seem to be hurt or something. To him it's all about trust and why we thought we couldn't trust him. He needs to get over it and realize it was a move made in a game. I WANT to keep him in this game right now, but he's asking Jason why he should go to final three with us if we are a pair. Um... you have bigger things to worry about right now, Superman... like even SURVIVING until final three, considering he just came out on the wrong side of a blindside, and if we wanted to, we could vote him out next round. He'd better watch it. He says he wants to work with us, but he has no room to be demanding terms right now... or questioning our motives either. We currently own him.

Inigo, on the other hand, scares the crap out of me. He basically threatened me by "reminding me" that he hasn't told Jason I considered targeting him. Yeah, and I don't need him doing that at any point down the line. Inigo is going to try to hold that over my head now, and he is trying REALLY hard to get information from me. I don't want to provide him with any information he could use to set me up, so I'm trying to sound like I'm talking to him without saying much... but I can only do so much of that before he knows something isn't right, and then I risk him spilling the beans. I'm being freaking blackmailed, in a way.

As of now, though, Darth is agreeing to vote Inigo out next, so long as Rocky agrees. I HAVE to make Rocky agree. Then me, Jason, Darth, Rocky, and Freddy will vote Inigo up out of this game and I can breathe for a minute. Until then, I'm going to be stressing.

As for who I actually want to go to the end of this game with? Freddy and Superman. But it's not happening. They don't talk. In fact, they both SAY they want to go to the end with me and Jason, which is a horrible idea for both of them. I don't want to go with Jason. I want him to be another one of my big moves. I'd go with Darth. I'm just not sure if he'd take me out ahead of time.

But if Freddy is honest about not trying to win, maybe he really do what he claims and just play to keep me safe. Who knows...
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Michael Myers
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If Superman is really smart, he'll work with me for a while and then make a move AGAINST me... with someone like Darth.
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