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| Sam Olver - The Future at 10? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 21 2016, 03:51 PM (312 Views) | |
| Wibble | Nov 21 2016, 03:51 PM Post #1 |
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Senior Player
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We had plenty of chat about Harry and how he looked the real deal at 12. I think we all agree that his kicking game ads an extra dimension to what we have thats a real point of difference. Thats all well and good, we seem to have Harry and Hutch as replacements at 12 where we were all sure we had a problem. But, we all agree we need a replacement at 10. Some people think Myler is not good enough, Some like me Think he's been great and he has some legs left but we all know we need backup for now and someone ready to take over in a year or two. So is it Sam Olver? The lad has had his chance sue to 1) the LV= comming when it did and 2) JJ being long term injured. I have not seem much of JJ. He could be a great player for all i know but he is Irish. If he proves himself to be a top player what chances do we have of keeping him for 10 years? English players like Olver have incentives to stay in the prem that other nationalities dont. Dont get me wrong, if Dan Carter or Johnny Sexton rocked up tomorrow wanting to play for Saints i would be happy but the best way we have of planning for the distant future is to develop a player of our own who is English Qualified. So with that "Explanation" in place, do i think he is the real deal? Short answer is yes. Watching his great kicking performance against Gloucester showed me he has a lot of natural tallent. The last 20 mins were all very messy but up to that point not only was his kicking from hand causing the opposition a lot of problems but from the tee he kepped the score ticking over as he was quite reliable (the most important skill for a kicking 10) Added to that was his great drop goal. That was a thing of beauty and part of the game Saints have struggled with for a LONG time. The Drop goal is something Irish teams have been masters at and something that could be a real weapon for us. Its yet another thing a team has to keep in mind when watching the 10. It could also really help us with our issue of scoring trys. We get into the 22 very often but unless the ref is on our side we tend to keep bashing up against a brick wall hoping for a penalty as we struggle so much to break through defenses who (lets be honest) seem to get away with a lot in the modern game. I think he needs to bulk up a little bit but thats more his age than anything, I dont want him to slow down or anything but he looks a little like a boy playing a mans game at times. He also needs to work on his game management. His kicks are good but he does not always seem to take the best choice, that will come with time. So if Jim sees him as the natural next step what should we expect? Well 10 mins at the end of games wont be any use at all. Jim is conservative by nature so i doubt he will just chuck him in as a starter but 1st choice in LV= games and 25-30 mins at the end of games would be a good start. Its not the answer to all our problems, no player is that but it might answer one of the biggest questions we have had for a while now. And yes, He can kick. |
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| happyclapper | Nov 21 2016, 05:26 PM Post #2 |
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I've not seen enough to comment. But for my view, with the way our season is going, you keep your best 15 players on the pitch while they're fit and have got fuel left in the tank. This means, unless Myler is having a stinker or unless we're 20+ points clear, we keep Myler on. LV, yes let Olver have that, until the final, if we make it. |
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| flanker | Nov 21 2016, 08:24 PM Post #3 |
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Next year: Ford first choice; Olver second. |
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| Bedford Saint | Nov 21 2016, 08:49 PM Post #4 |
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Transfer talk has us linked with Cruden (gave up the chase as he wanted too much money) and Ford. How true either rumour is, I dont know, but those are the sorts of players we need in the key positions. Also rumoured JJ is off back to Munster at the end of the season. Not sure if Olver could make a top top class 10, but to my mind he should have been pushing much more for a 1st team place if he is the real deal. There is 18 months between him and Ford. I know players develop at different rates, so maybe he is a later developer. Would love to see it happen, but I'm far from convinced. The academy lads need to be pushing on, Collins as an example, broke into the team and seems to have stagnated, Packman is lightening quick, but never gets a chance, so the coaches mustn't have enough faith in him. Others like Harry and Hutch have come in recently and grabbed the opportunity with both hands and could well be classed as 1st choice now. Who'd be a coach ??? |
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| ElmaFudd | Nov 21 2016, 09:17 PM Post #5 |
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I don't think Olver will be a top, by which I mean international standard fly-half but he could become a really good club level one. He's got a brain and punches above his weight in defence but I don't think his distribution show any sign of being better than Myler and he isn't a fly half who will break the gain line. In fact I beleive he is very similar to Myler. So is he the future? I'm not sure it depends on so many thing's like who becomes available in the meantime. I think the coaches will invest in him in terms of time but will be looking out for a new 1st choice. Forget the rumours about Ford He will be too expensive and won't suit our style of play. P.s; I'm always wrong about this sort of thing |
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| Bedford Saint | Nov 21 2016, 09:46 PM Post #6 |
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No disrespect, but I hope you are wrong. Our style of play isnt exactly ripping up any trees right now. New attack coach, new fly half and a new style of play is needed along with forwards who can boss a game. Lets spend the TV money wisely. |
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| ElmaFudd | Nov 21 2016, 09:51 PM Post #7 |
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I agree with you. I just can't see any reason why Ford would want to come here to play in a team playing our way. We do need to spend the money wisely. |
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| happyclapper | Nov 22 2016, 12:25 AM Post #8 |
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I really don't want Ford. I know I am probably wrong as wiser people than me rave about him, but I just don't see it. He goes missing in big games, and I think England would be rubbish without Farrell there steadying the ship for him. I'd much rather see Farrell and Slade. |
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| ElmaFudd | Nov 22 2016, 08:55 AM Post #9 |
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Yeah I rate both higher than Ford... wonder if Mr Foley would like the Weedon Rd chippy? Now he is a flyhalf I'd like to ser in Saints colours. |
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| Onward | Nov 22 2016, 09:57 AM Post #10 |
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Agree with Bedford Saint. Step one forwards that do what forwards are supposed to in the scrums, lineouts and loose play. We had this about two years ago and then someone decided that we needed forwards that ran around a bit in preference to set play. Clearly hasn't worked. Step two get a attack coach then let him have some influence on a new fly half. Then at least they will be on the same page. Myler has been a great servant and his role will be on the bench to come on and steady the ship if there are problems just like Hodgson did for Sarries. There is little point in getting a new fly and then a coach. Agree don't want Ford. If you want a new fly either go down the vallies or SH |
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| happyclapper | Nov 22 2016, 10:28 AM Post #11 |
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Yep, coach first and then new FH, if we need one. Remember we do have JJ and he was heralded on arrival. I'd still like to see him given a run to see what he can do. Also I think Harry is nailed 12 to his back now so the 10 option is no longer there for him. Which means, in my eyes JJ and Myler competing for starting berth this season and next, with Olver as backup. Then eventually JJ and Olver competing for starting berth. Unless we sign Barrett that is... ;-) |
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| flanker | Nov 22 2016, 01:36 PM Post #12 |
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As we've said before, how many of our back line apart from North would get in the first teams of the leading clubs? Malinder, Foden...? |
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| big mac returns | Nov 24 2016, 12:17 PM Post #13 |
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Would hate it if we signed ford, hes crap. and no he cant kick! and same with cruden, cant kick! If u want to win big games u need a player who can nail penaltys all day long so unless we sign halfpenny to play 15 we need a 10 who can kick. I dont think Olver is ever going to be a top class 10, would love to be proved wrong and h has shown some glimpses, but i definitely think he will be a great club player for us and push our starting ten. we also have young Grayson coming through and there is a fair bit of hype about him. (amazing the number of former players kids that are coming through) We do need some investment in our backs i think, I see sarries have signed liam williams to replace ashton, they'll have tidy back three. I'd like to see better competition/cover for foden hes just starting to get back in my eyes, but that normally means horrendous injury to follow. i like our centre options with the young guns coming through. we have wingers coming out of our ears. so maybe its the halfs where the investment should go. a scrum half is a must for us, we downgraded considerably since kahn went. you never know by all accounts we have some tremendous disabled toilets at franklins gardens, maybe that could tempt the best player on the planet to sign for us? our options at 10: 1: we go as we are, JJ gets fit and stays, him and myler rotate, olver covers and pushes with goal to replace myler long term with JJ as the main man. whilst the messiah Grayson develops. 2: JJ leaves, we sign a big name, myler rotates, olver covers and pushes with goal to replace myler long term. whilst the messiah Grayson develops. 3: JJ Leaves, we sign a top prospect/young top name to be our no.10 for the next 10 years, myler rotates, olver covers and pushes with goal to replace myler long term. whilst the messiah Grayson develops. 4: JJ leaves, we sign another experienced pro (like a nick evans) to cover/rotate with smyler, olver covers and pushes with goal to replace myler long term. whilst the messiah Grayson develops. 5: JJ leaves, we back SMyler with Olver rotating backing him to become a solid pro for us and watch the mountains of gold build up. whilst the messiah Grayson develops. |
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| flanker | Nov 24 2016, 01:52 PM Post #14 |
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Myler has never coped well with rotating. His form goes and the other one has got squeezed out. |
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| ElmaFudd | Nov 24 2016, 02:00 PM Post #15 |
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So lets be clear on this one Mac. Do you think Grayson could be the next big thing? |
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| Wibble | Nov 24 2016, 02:35 PM Post #16 |
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Lol. :-) |
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| big mac returns | Nov 24 2016, 03:02 PM Post #17 |
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Thats what I hear, however that was more of a joke then a statement of fact, I've not seen enough to really make a judgement, hes look decent from what ive seen but that means nothing. I agree SMyler has never really worked too well with rotation and his best season ever (when we won the thing) there was no real challenge. however lets not get carried away with that idea cause who he was competing with was Ryan Lamb and Shane Geraghty, not dan carter and stephen larkham. |
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| happyclapper | Nov 24 2016, 03:17 PM Post #18 |
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I think Mac is talking about Myler doing a Hodgson esque role... |
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| big mac returns | Nov 24 2016, 04:53 PM Post #19 |
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all really depends on what route we take. this is the first year Smyler has ever really had a niggling injuries, i remember he had an ankle injury at the beginning of the season when we signed geraghty, other then that pretty much played every game. SMyler could still have alot of games left in him, Nick Evans is about 36 and still plays most games. |
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| ElmaFudd | Nov 24 2016, 06:50 PM Post #20 |
Senior Player
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yeah sorry Mac is was a gently bit of teasing from me just reading your list made me smile. Seriously I have also heard only good about Grayson Jnr but have seen very little. (One Wandies appearance I think). So yeah it's impossible to judge. I agree R.E Myler.I think he's earned the right to take more of a back seat and let someone else take on the role of steering the ship. I was hoping that JJ may fulfill that role and he may do so if he can stay injury free and plays to a good enough level he could make the 10 shirt his for the rest of the season. lets hope so. |
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| happyclapper | Nov 24 2016, 07:44 PM Post #21 |
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Personally I think Myler keeps the 10 shirt while he's still our best 10, which at the moment he is. Rest him for LV and, if we hit some form, lesser opposition. But otherwise he is starting 10. If JJ finds some form in the games he gets, then great, otherwise Smyler is our man. Olver needs game time but could be good if he gets some timber on. Have seen nothing of Grayson Jnr but would take him if he's 50% of his Dad - that's how highly I rated Larry! |
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| flanker | Nov 24 2016, 08:06 PM Post #22 |
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Now, he could kick. |
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| Ossie Reborn | Nov 25 2016, 05:14 PM Post #23 |
Fringe Player
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Grayson? If I may draw this debate to its natural conclusion...... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plZRe1kPWZw |
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3:40 PM Jul 11