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| Um...what happened Keiji? | |
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| Topic Started: Apr 10 2007, 11:08 PM (3,198 Views) | |
| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 10 2007, 11:08 PM Post #1 |
The Blade Of Ganryû
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Sorry for lack of an avatar, damn photobucket isnt working right now. -.- Firstly, let me introduce myself, real names Brad and ive played both SW and DW extensivly and Musou Orochi is a dream come true (i said they should do a SW, DW cross, imagine my suprize when i read about it) my fave characters are Yukimura And Zhao Yun, i admire there courage and honor. Any way, unto the matter at hand. ive noticed with SW2: Empires and Musou Orochi, Koei seems to have redirected there "OMG MONSTER" towards Tadakatsu rather then Keiji, im not complaining but does it seem weird to anyone else? i mean in the original SW, when you seen Keiji, you knew you were in for a fight, thats not saying Tadakatsu wasent but Keiji was the monster, the guy looking to fight, wild and care free, he lived to fight. However with the coming of SW2 and more specifically SW2: Empires, everytime something needed guarding, everytime something needed to die, theres Tadakatsu, once again i state that i am in no way complaining, and i understand that Tadakatsu may seem a more daunting character then Keiji given his military record and stature, however it seems weird for Koei to up and abandon Keiji as there main guy. Now more recently, with MO on its way, the trailer vividly shows the epic battle between Lu Bu and Tadakatsu, i love this fight seen but i always pictured it being Keiji and Lu Bu, the two men who searched all over there respective countrys for, in Lu Bu`s words "a decent challange" and the similaritys are uncany, Two giant, polearm weilding men, both reknowned for there legendary skill and monsterous horses, Matsukaze and Red Hare Respectivly, Matsu, being untamable and wild, only allowing Keiji to ride him and lets not forget "among horses, Red hare." Does anyone else feel this way? like Koei shifted its focus from Keiji to Tadakatsu, or am i going nuts? Sanda Yukimura |
" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Tenkoshiro | Apr 11 2007, 12:19 AM Post #2 |
don't get too excited, i might leave again y'know
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I don't really think that Keiji is that strong in real life but I'm sure(not really)
 that Tadakatsu Honda is just like Lu Bu who is an "OMG MONSTER" so when Tadakatsu Honda became playable Tadakatsu became the greatest warrior in the land uh I think ........... Get It?
 :wacko:
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 11 2007, 12:24 AM Post #3 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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Yah, i understand that view point, but i dont get it, just because Tadakatsu was the new playable hotness, dosent justify Koei just throwing Keiji to the winds, well, perhaps justify is a strong word....i just dont think it makes sense? here one day, gone the next? kinda kills keijis awesomeness for future games imo, like in MO for example, i cant see him having a major role with the focus being Tadakatsu vs Lu Bu, what else does keiji do but ride around on Matsu? nothing -.- |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Divine Justice | Apr 11 2007, 12:25 AM Post #4 |
L's True Successor
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That's not saying that I don't agree though. Keiji was definitely the top guy until Tadakatsu came along in SWXL (I'd say that as playable characters, Keiji was still better in XL, but as enemies they were about the same). Keiji, and everyone else for that matter, is much better in this game though 
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"If you can't beat the game, if you can't solve the puzzle, you're nothing but a loser." 俺様こそ、あ、日本一！ | |
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 11 2007, 12:31 AM Post #5 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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You sir, have just made my day with this little tidbit, im trying to starve myself of MO, seeing as i ruined SW2 by seeing all the cutscences before it was out in english, and knowing what Lu Bu`s role is in the game im extremely happy now
 i dont even like Keiji as a character, as a personality and actual person, i love him though. |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| vyle | Apr 11 2007, 12:42 AM Post #6 |
INDIEcisive
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Feel the same way and iam not happy lets just say :angry: |
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| Seraphil | Apr 11 2007, 12:59 AM Post #7 |
稲が成敗いたします！
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I never understand the Keiji fanboyism. I never got feeling of fear/awe fighting him in SW1, I had more of that when fighting Nobunaga or even Hanzo (because Hanzo sometimes ninja-appear at worst time, like when I had red health at end of certain Osaka stage...) He's just some wandering yokel, kabuki man, sure he's strong, but he only has like one big accomplishment to his name (Hasedo retreat) when even Lu Bu had several (taking Pu Yang, defend Hu Lao, etc.) Did you know Tadakatsu HAS his own horse? It's even in SW2! Tadakatsu has many more accomplishments and renown than Keiji. In many battles, never once got hurt, compared to legendary Zhang Yide, has famous Tonbo Giri spear like Lu Bu has famous Crescent Halberd. Lu Bu didn't "search all over" for a decent challenge unless you get his ending in DW5. Usually he dies like a rat in Xia Pi, hahaha. Koei didn't "redirect" the "SAIKYO" aura to Tadakatsu, they FIXED it away from Keiji. Keiji never got a theme song anyway. Tadakatsu has an awesome one. ...but, Keiji has OCTOPUS robe, very cool... |
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 11 2007, 01:07 AM Post #8 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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I do know that Tadakatsu has his own horse, and him never getting hurt is a legend, though an easily believeable and probally true one. and though his acomplishments are many, i dont think any of Tadakatsu`s have the magnatude of Keiji`s one, except Tadakatsu`s early uses of the musket rotation system. possibly. edit: and i think Keiji has a theme, but it dosent play like Tadakatsu`s |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Seraphil | Apr 11 2007, 01:20 AM Post #9 |
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稲が成敗いたします！
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The closest Keiji had to a theme I guess was City of Flowers, which is actually Okuni's theme... |
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 11 2007, 01:22 AM Post #10 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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Ya, thats what i was refering to, though i thought it was called Dance in the capital, dunno why i thought that though. but in the mean time, themes a theme, may not be awesome like Tadakatsu`s, but its still a theme. |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Seraphil | Apr 11 2007, 01:33 AM Post #11 |
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稲が成敗いたします！
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It's Okuni's theme, not Keiji. I just said that. |
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| Hondam | Apr 11 2007, 04:06 AM Post #12 |
轟
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Topic creator: As PS said, Keiji has one reknown accomplishment in his life, and it wasn't even that big of a thing. Trying to compare the KOEI protrayals of Keiji and Tadakatsu is all fine and great, but Keiji will always lose when you try to compare the historical men. Keiji didn't do much of anything in history, and those are the facts. Tadakatsu did. |
Wisdom has existence, principle has existence, the Way has existence, spirit is nothingness. Arigato to Blackkite. Kirigakure Saizo, Hattori Hanzou, Sasaki Kojiro, Ii Naomasa, and Tachibana Muneshige for SB3! | |
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 11 2007, 04:11 AM Post #13 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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You see, thats a biased opinion, quantity dosent matter, Tadakatsu did have an illustrious military carer, and he was a great warrior, but did he do anything monumental? no. sure he fought at some of the most notable battle in japanese history but nothing really stands out besides the fact that he had such a commanding presence and exited every battle unscathed. |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Ginn Sing | Apr 12 2007, 08:59 AM Post #14 |
The Guardian!
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well for all we know Honda tadakatsu may have been a grand leading general and defeated anyone he duealed and then let his army of uber archers and muskets kill everything the fact is koei bases most of their games on the what if factor |
 < its the closest i could get to him.Why Me? Surely the shortest but the smartest! | |
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| Tenkoshiro | Apr 12 2007, 12:14 PM Post #15 |
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don't get too excited, i might leave again y'know
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And another thing is that in Samurai Warriors 1 Keiji is kinda like a sweet( my opinion) to Okuni and it does not fit him that he spend a lot of time with okuni than being a slayer like Lu Bu and since he is a bit good there (good=nice) maybe koei thought that Keiji is not fit to be best though he has a special horse , matsukaze, but I must say that I lost my respect for Keiji in Samurai Warriors 2 ... I feel bad for a bit abondoned Keiji though! |
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| Ranmaru Mori | Apr 12 2007, 06:51 PM Post #16 |
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Gone
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He was in the most notable battles, was an excellent warrior, and always came out unscathed.....how is that not monumental. That's like downplaying someone curing cancer. I'm gonna have to say you're 3000% wrong here. Honda had an illustrious career, Keiji didn't. Not biased, fact. |
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| Sanada | Apr 12 2007, 07:00 PM Post #17 |
The end has come.
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Firstly, Him being an excelent warrior is nothing monumental. Being in the most notable battles doesn't mean he did much, so not monumental. exiting every battle unscratced is just a legend, not a fact. |
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| Ranmaru Mori | Apr 12 2007, 07:09 PM Post #18 |
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Gone
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What IS monumental then? Apparently you are a great samurai warrior, since you have so much insight and knowledge on what makes a man great? Do you have to play with children outside of battle? Be a good farmer? WHAT then? And you're the one who brough tup him being unscathed. So don't drop "facts" if you don't want them thrown back at you. |
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| Sanada | Apr 12 2007, 07:11 PM Post #19 |
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The end has come.
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i didnt bring it in, ur mistaking me (Sanada) for the guy who started this (Sanada yukimura) >.> |
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| Ranmaru Mori | Apr 12 2007, 07:12 PM Post #20 |
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Gone
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:lol: Good point. Sorry, my hatred for the character must be spreading. Well, ignore that tidbit. We can relay it to Sanada#2 later. |
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| Sanada | Apr 12 2007, 07:20 PM Post #21 |
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The end has come.
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Anyway, back on topic. Monumental things rnt unproven legends, and being in battles that may hve done nothing in
 Its more of large things that hve happened in battle. (Such as Hasedo for Keiji, or Osaka and Ueda for Yukimura)
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| Sanada Yukimura | Apr 12 2007, 09:32 PM Post #22 |
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The Blade Of Ganryû
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Exactly, Greatness is measured in moments, like for example Keijis "He then agreed to join Kanetsugu in his invasion of Aizu. During the retreat from the failed invasion, Keiji was given the task of leading the rear guard. Riding his horse Matsukaze into battle and brandishing a two-pronged spear, he made a splendid show of force. Due to Keiji's prowess, the Uesugi Army returned unscathed." that is what im defending, sure Honda had an amazing career as a soilder, but did he do anything similar to what ive quoted above? no. because of Keijis prowess and ability to rise to the occasion a entire army was spared, Honda may have been the best warrior from Mikawa, and the finest in the Tokugawa but he never used his amazing skill to do anything rememberable such as Keiji. sorry if im misspelling often, my keyboard is sticking. -.- |
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" I am Sanada Yukimura, an opponent no doubt quite worthy of you, but i am too tired to fight anymore..."
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| Seraphil | Apr 12 2007, 09:58 PM Post #23 |
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稲が成敗いたします！
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...Komaki? The Kanegasaki retreat? Fighting Naito Masatoyo at Mikatagahara? |
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| LoW | Apr 12 2007, 10:02 PM Post #24 |
This guy definitely isn't a rock anymore....
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At Komaki Tadakatsu was able to stop Hideyoshi's forces with only few hundred men >_>. I would say that's pretty impressive :rolleyes:. But I don't mind if Tadakatsu keeps his "Mightiest Warrior" title because those characters are always considered as extremely broken. I don't want my precious Keiji to have that title. He already suffered from that in SW1 :(. |
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| Sanada | Apr 12 2007, 10:05 PM Post #25 |
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The end has come.
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Im pretty sure in SW2:E Keiji is given the title "Craziest Warrior in Japan" xD |
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