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| Stats - general discussion, Q&A, and index; Updated as of 11/19/09 | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 2 2008, 06:51 PM (1,419 Views) | |
| KauSu | Jul 21 2009, 12:25 AM Post #26 |
Ike's owner
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Jian is indeed a great general. Let's not forget that in stats, 50 = avarage. So having 90 LDR still makes him extraordinary, but Jian does NOT deserve higher LDR than Deng Ai, or Zhang Liao. Not even Ce or Zhou Yu. To sum this up, I don't want this to turn into an argument or anything. Because it'll be like arguing with a wall that says "I'm right, you're wrong." for both of us. Jian's RTKXI stats aren't bad, they do him good. But he certianly does not deserve higher than that. People that DO deserve higher LDR/WAR are Yue Jin, Li Dian, Zhang Liao, Zhou Tai, Chen Dao, Cao Ren, Man Chong.. and some others. While other people deserve some of their stats cut, mostly Shu officers. Just because Zhao Yun supposedly rode into a one million man army. (That keeps getting mentioned and defeated, clearly a great exaggeration.) and killed Xiahou En while he was busy plundering a village, does not make him deserve his LDR/WAR/INT. -Wall of text end.- P.S I'm unable to post much due to being out of the country for a while, visiting relatives. I'll be back to my post-bot self in a few days. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| the glorious sun jian | Jul 21 2009, 06:57 AM Post #27 |
IT IS TIME TO CUT DONG ZHOU,S HEAD and DRINK IT,S BLOOD
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To be honest it is not only me , but many people agree that Jian deserves more LDR than Zhang Liao , Sun Ce , (the highly overrated Zhou Yu ) and Deng Ai . Some members on the other forums are even convinced that he deserves 100 LDR !! RTK 10 has it his stats like this : LDR =98 WAR=92 INT=77 POL=72 CHR=91 and he deserves every single point . OK what makes Jian so special as a leader : 1) While he had a low titles and positions , many men joined him from many provinces .He alwasy attracted men wherever he was . 2) Early battles against Xu Chang and his sons where Jian called troops and joined the fight .He gathered men and trained them at a very fast rate . 3) Jian had 3 heavy defeats , the first one against the Yellow turbans the other two are agaist the Qiang and Xu Rong .What makes his defeats so special is his abillity to gather his forces together and have a successful counter attack in no time . 4) The long and hard battle against Dong Zhou and Yuan Shao .This is what makes Jian so famous .He was isolated between an enemy and a possible enemy from behind .He was very calm and a political man .He chose Yuan Shu for a reason and left Luo Yang for another reason . His way to control his troops when the enemy was just about to attack his camp forced them to retreat  (There a few exampls of how a well controlled army can force an enemy to retreat .5) Most of his battles were fought with poor quality of troops .Dong Zhou noticed that . 6) Hi skill was feared by Dong Zhou (aka the strongest man is that time ) . Sun Ce was better than his father in some aspects , but as a leader I think that Jian is better with Ce being better in using his own officers . Zhang Liao was great .He Fei was a hard battle ,but the enviroment helped and he was defending not invading . Zhou Yu was very overrated and yeah he doesnt deserve more than 86 LDR . Deng Ai was a great general but he had all the support he needed .He had a great army sent to him by the goverment .He did a great job with them , but that's it . Poeple like Cao Cao , Sun Jian and Liu Bei will always be considered great because of their virtue in gathering men .A skill that is simply lacked by many other generals . Edited by the glorious sun jian, Jul 21 2009, 07:29 AM.
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| KauSu | Jul 21 2009, 11:28 AM Post #28 |
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As I said, Jian is a great general, having his RTK11 stats isn't unfair at all. It still has him as one of the top notch generals. My point is, while Jian haven't won that much large-scale battles, how does it make him a better leader, or warrior than Zhang Liao? And a point in RTK11, since Liao "defended" He Fei. LDR in RTKXI attributes to the DEFENSE of the units, so what you should be asking for is more WAR, not LDR. And as I've said before. RTKX Jian's stats were exaggerated. His XI stats are more fair and balanced. On the other hand.. Look at the other underrated generals, Mainly Li Dian and Yue Jin. Li Dian should have either more LDR, or CHR. since he kept his colleagues in control whenever they started to flip out. Yue Jin for his participation in many battles against bandits, rebels, Wu(at He Fei) and so on. Basically what I'm saying is, your "Underrated" Sun Jian. Is actually fair-stated in XI. While the ones that SHOULD have higher stats, are not. p.s Zhou Yu is not overrated, hello, remember Chi Bi? Last time I checked, Kong Ming didn't fart out the wind in official history.. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| the glorious sun jian | Jul 21 2009, 12:09 PM Post #29 |
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IT IS TIME TO CUT DONG ZHOU,S HEAD and DRINK IT,S BLOOD
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Sun Jian fought and won more wars than Zhang Liao .He was the main leader and the direct battle commander .That makes him better as a leader than Zhang Liao . What makes him better as a warrior is some of his heroic and crazy moves he has done with the pirates and the yellow turban . You fogot that LDR is used in gathering armies and attracting officers .Something that Jian was better than Liao . Li Dian and Yue Jin are underrated but that doesn't mean Jian can be cosidered well rated .Not with Guan Yu scoring that 95 while he deserves 72 . Chi Bi was Huang Gai's plan . The battle against Cao Ren was Lu Meng's plan . The battle against Ru Xu was Lu Meng's victory . Ling Tong defended the camp against Wei . Sun Ce took Wu . The only good thing Zhou Yu did was to convince Quan to fight and that was more of Lu Su work than Zhou Yu . Aaah he did a good thing when he died and left Lu Su and Lu Meng .Those two were better than him . BTW Yue Jin and Li Dian both had a better stats in RTK X .It seems that RTK XI screwed up with the stats after all . |
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| KauSu | Jul 22 2009, 03:10 AM Post #30 |
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Ike's owner
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Jian fought in many battles, but never scored as great of a victory as Liao's. He did fight well, against Hua Xiong at Si Shui, Rebels and Pirates. Also against Huang Zu. Let us look at Liao, then. He fought against Yuan Shao's heirs, against the Wuhuan (aka Wuwan ingame?). If you really look at it, nothing that Jian did had as big of an impact as He Fei. Edit: We're both talking about two of the greatest Generals statwise and calling them underrated. Let's talk about the REALLY underrated ones. Like, Zhu Ran for instance, he should have like LDR: 92 WAR:84 INT: 81 POL: 72 CHR: 80 or so, what do you think? Edited by KauSu, Jul 22 2009, 03:25 AM.
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| the glorious sun jian | Jul 22 2009, 07:12 AM Post #31 |
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IT IS TIME TO CUT DONG ZHOU,S HEAD and DRINK IT,S BLOOD
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Sun Jian defeated the much talented Dong Zhou and Lu Bu in 2 battles in a very short time . Defeated Hua Xiong at Yang Ren and not Si Shu Gate . Fought against the Qiang a much stronger tribe than Wuwan men .Had heroic deeds in every fight he fought in . Zhang Liao's He Fei is a little tricky one .While he gained a great victory it was nowhere near the one in the novel .To say nothing that Zhang Liao had all support from behind . Remember that Ru Xu ? where Zhang Liao and Cao Cao were unable to defeat Lu Meng' plan ... In Jian battle against Dong Zhou , he holds a bigger impact than Zhang Liao for me . Zhu Ran was one of Wu greatest general , at some point he had reputation similar to Liao's amongest the Wei forces . But , I see Xu Sheng as the greatest Wu commander after Sun Ce and Lu Meng .That man got it all . However , as you have said , the game must be balanced and giving everyone a 90ish LDR would destroy it , still some people dont deserve their LDR : Guan Yu , Zhou Yu , Sima Yi and Lu Xun . |
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| KauSu | Jul 22 2009, 09:10 PM Post #32 |
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Ike's owner
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Yes. Which brings me to my last point- It's a game, one that is based heavily on a novel, a little bit on history. Jian, does not have a huge impact in the novel, but does have a nice impact in history. Liao, on the other hand, along with many others. Have large impacts on both novel and history. Jian, is by no means underrated. His stats are fine. It's the overrated officers that make him look bad, which is a fact you're overlooking. As I said in the first place. This is going to be an endless argument, because you, on one hand, favor Jian greatly, while I, on the other. Don't favor him, but don't dislike him either. I think that he's one of the best officers stat wise. And his RTKXI stats were fine. Sure though, Guan Yu needs a major reduction in everything, specially LDR and INT. He's a retard with a beard, reminds me of bin laden... ANYHOO.. I just got home, I'm tired, peace out bro. EDIT: Xu Sheng is the fricken leetsauce. I like him almost as much as I do Yue Jin. Edited by KauSu, Jul 22 2009, 09:11 PM.
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Wu Song | Jul 23 2009, 01:03 PM Post #33 |
General of the North
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I was thinking about posting the stat from the three game of Romance of the Three Kingdoms ... I will edit my post once I have them EDIT:I have Cao Cao stat in the 208 game in ROT3K III -Cao Cao- INT:102 POL:105 WAR:97 CHRM:100 ARMY:93 NAVY:59 TRN:66 MRL:60 and if you ask me his stat look better in the newer game then in the third game IMO Edited by Wu Song, Jul 23 2009, 01:09 PM.
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| KauSu | Jul 26 2009, 03:39 AM Post #34 |
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Ike's owner
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Just thought I'd say that, Xun You is the bomb. Focus, ownage INT, high Pol. High Chr. Decent Ldr. He's like the perfect lieutenant/support unit in combat. Also a perfect strategist/civil officer. What'cha think? |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| KauSu | Aug 2 2009, 07:07 PM Post #35 |
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Ike's owner
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Update, bump and revive! Brought to you by KauSu, he who spots the underrated, and passionately hates the overrated Shu generals! Today, I bring you 2 officers! From the usual underrated Wei Dynasty! Zang Ba: Current stats are: LDR: 74 WAR: 75 INT: 52 POL: 56 CHR: 71 Should be: LDR: 83 WAR: 80 INT: 60 [ Raise in Cavalry Apt to S, Spears / pikes to A/A ] POL: 68 CHR: 71 Reason: Zang Ba fought vs The turbans as Cavalry captain, later raised a personal army and went to Lu Bu's aid, fought against Cao Cao, dueled Yue Jin to a draw, and together with Lu Bu's army, pushed back Cao's forces. In the persuit, together with Zhang Liao, crushed Lu Qian and Cao Hong's armies. In the attack on Yuan Shu, Zang Ba scored many victories. Later, after Lu Bu's defeat. Zhang Liao persuaded him to serve Cao Cao, he held many ranks, such as General of the Guard and titled Lord of a Capital Precinct. Later on he was also appointed as Prefect of Xuzhou city. Summarized reason: HE FRICKEN ROCKS. Officer 2! Sun Guan! Current Stats: LDR: 72 WAR: 78 INT: 51 POL: 39 CHR: 66 Should be: LDR: 80 WAR:82 INT: 60 [ Raise in Cavalry Apt to S, Spears / pikes to A/A ] POL: 52 [Skill changed to Exterminate or w/e] CHR: 66 Reason: Praised as second only to Zang Ba, fought alongside him on many, if not all of his battles. Known for his valor, and praised by Cao Cao for his bravery. Held some positions like Administrator of Bei Hai, and such. Took an arrow wound but kept slaughtering the Wu scumbags. (Wu must've suffered the most losses in the three kingdoms period, everyone owned them at some point.), later died from that wound, pretty kickass. Thoughts?! p.s Ikeeee when are you coming backkkkkkk this subforum is lonely without you ;'( Edited by KauSu, Aug 3 2009, 04:01 PM.
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Ike | Aug 4 2009, 01:27 AM Post #36 |
Meister
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*Appears* Sorry about that! I just frequent other sites too I lost track on Koeiwarriors for a while there. :| Anyway, here I am. Zang Ba and Sun Guan are two of my favorite generals, to that end they deserve to be spoiled. I agree with the stats you gave them, Guan would go nicely with Exterminate if not Cavalry General would be perfect. I can't believe they were not given awesome stats to begin with. Talking about two great general's who fought early before the three kingdoms and participating in countless battles doing exceedingly well with their respected lords. |
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| KauSu | Aug 4 2009, 03:16 PM Post #37 |
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Ike's owner
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Lame excuse..You'll get no sympathy from me! *Chuck norris style roundhouse kick.* Anyway, like I said before, whoever was on the stat-giving team in charge of RTK, was either high, or retarded. So many of their stats don't even make sense, giving Guan Yu higher stats than people like Zhang Liao, Sun Jian, Zang Ba and Yue Jin is just wrong, and a skill like God's Command..That's equal to being a Yu fangirl. Join me in desecrating the Guan Yu temples/memorials and so on. I'll give you cookies if you do.. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Wu Song | Aug 4 2009, 07:04 PM Post #38 |
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General of the North
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I am thinking about Posting some more stat from Romance of the Three Kingdoms 3 later on ... -Zhang Liao ROTK III stat- Int:80 Pol:68 War:90 Chr:83 -And Guan Yu ROTK III stat- Int:82 Pol:64 War:103 Chr:96 If you ask me Guan Yu ROTK III stat really do not suit him IMO Edited by Wu Song, Aug 4 2009, 10:59 PM.
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| Ike | Aug 7 2009, 04:38 PM Post #39 |
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*Ouch* that hurt >:( Yeah the only redeeming feature Guan Yu has kept over the years is his increasingly large beard. Which in turn deserves some standard stats for staying so dashingly straight. I'm sure the stats were all based off
You're right he deserves -50 on everything. |
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| KauSu | Aug 8 2009, 09:52 PM Post #40 |
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Ike's owner
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I like how, in the novel it said that Guan Yu, Zhang Fei and Liu Bei had to gangbang Lu Bu into retreating, yet Guan Yu gets 97 War, Zhang Fei gets 98 and Liu Bei gets 70ish, while Lu Bu gets a 100, way to overestimate people. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Wu Song | Aug 12 2009, 04:50 PM Post #41 |
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General of the North
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Ok some more stat from ROT3K III -Zhuge Liang- INT:100 POL:92 WAR:61 CHR:95 -Han Ze- INT:78 POL:85 WAR:45 CHR:72 -Sima Yi- INT:98 POL:90 WAR:62 CHR:80 and I think mess up on Kan Ze family name as well in ROT3K III ... |
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| KauSu | Aug 16 2009, 02:24 AM Post #42 |
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Ike's owner
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Ding Ding! Revived with another Cao Wei general! This time, it's the awesome, the mighty Wang Shuang! As an intro, I have to say that Wang Shuang's intellect, leadership and charisma were underrated. He scored a number of victories against Zhuge Liang's forces at Chen Cang, and, Wei Yan didn't even kill him. He died in open battle with Zhuge's forces, I believe. Anyway, his feigned retreat against Zhang Ni(Yi), his quick disposal of Xie Xiong and Gong Qi, and so on, earns him much better leadership and intelligence than given to him. KOEI made him look like a retarded gorilla, only suitable for bashing skulls out. (He was, but he wasn't retarded!) Anyway, the stats that KOEI gave him are listed below, and below them, the stats that I think he deserves. KOEI: LDR: 64 WAR: 88 INT: 19 POL: 22 CHR: 27 KauSu: LDR: 82 (Yes, he knew how to lead men.) WAR: 90 (LESS QQ MORE PEW PEW) INT: 69 (Yes, I rate him as above average in INT.) POL: 20 CHR: 60 (Bear-like waist and tiger-like back? now that's f*cking charismatic!) |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Ike | Aug 21 2009, 09:18 PM Post #43 |
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Typo huh? They did the same for lots of characters around the series. Zhang ''Yue'' being an example ha-ha.
Nice update KauSu. Wang Shuang to me, is a beast. In all games he's always been great for fighting. He makes units ruthless and powerful. In turn makes him awesome. WAR is fine to me. But wouldn't make much of it, if it was raised by two. His major setback is his INT. Although in most games you can take time to raise it, it may not be worth it. His lifespan is usually short and due to that makes them fall to waste. CHA for him is messy. You need a lot of patience for characters like this. Mainly because no one likes you and therefore you must be a nicer suck up to be charismatic. LDR is alright but doesn't need much to boost around the high 70-ish would be right with me. POL for Wang Shuang? More like who gives a sh*t. Overall, he is really hard to play and does need some sort of decent stats to lean on. I'm in agreement to that. |
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| KauSu | Aug 22 2009, 01:35 PM Post #44 |
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Ike's owner
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I gave him his LDR/INT just in order to be fair. I mean, okay, he's a war machine. But that doesn't mean that he's a "ME SMASH HEAD YOU DIE" kind of person, he was a capable leader. And I'd say that he's one of the best later-years general. He died in combat and wasn't "cut down by Wei Yan" Did Ma Dai score victories against Sima Yi? no. Did Wang Shuang score some victories against Zhuge Liang? Yep. That's my point by the LDR/INT. @ Ike, I haven't played Wang Shuang on X yet, I don't even know his stats on there. Currently playing a created warrior called Xu Chen, whose stats is Zhang Liao'ish. Swore brotherhood with Cao Cao, also viceroy of Chu/Wu Yue. =O |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| Xuan Zhongda | Sep 1 2009, 09:23 PM Post #45 |
You're just that bad.
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He Jin: LDR: 40 -> 52 WAR: 39 -> 63 INT: 7 -> 5 POL: 39 -> 39 CHA: 71 -> 58 I don't really see why he was given such a low WAR stat I wouldfigure it would be more average due to being a butcher at on time. His LDR does deservde a little increase too. But, I can't really picture him being very Charaismatitic. Maybe it is his portraits or sumthin'. Kong Rong: LDR: 30 -> 43 WAR: 11 -> 11 INT: 74 -> 83 POL: 78 -> 73 CHA: 60 -> 87 Kong Rong ain't that bad of a leader, nor is he unchraismatic or smart. He kinda did save Wang Zhong's life  Sha Moke: LDR: 62 -> 71 WAR: 86 -> 87 INT: 27 -> 33 POL: 13 -> 13 CHA: 46 -> 53 I don't many particular reasons for stat increases, but the kill of Gn Ning deserves a little more LDR. |
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| KauSu | Sep 2 2009, 10:18 AM Post #46 |
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Ike's owner
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Huangfu Song: LDR: 87 -> 88 WAR: 61 -> 79 INT: 73 -> 81 POL: 51 -> 51 CHR: 72 -> 72 Reason: I don't need to explain, he's fricken Huangfu Song. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| KauSu | Oct 18 2009, 06:02 PM Post #47 |
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Ike's owner
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R-R-Revived! This guy, can be a source of much debate. This guy, was freakishly tall ( This guy, was strong headed and supposedly very brave on the battlefield. This guy, was going to be one of the top 3 officials when Cao Pi ascended the throne, but he kicked the bucket before he was officially assigned. Ladies and..well, all I care about = Ladies, sorry gents, not going to mention you. I BRING YOU, THE ONE, THE ONLY..CHENG YU! That's right. Cheng Yu. The man who was once named Cheng Li, was tall(scary), strong headed (also scary), had a "beautiful" beard (which is also scary.) and was respected by Cao Cao (THE VERY EMBODIMENT OF SCARYNESS) I don't need to prolong the intro, stats are below: Cheng Yu: LDR: 70 --> 81 (Very courageous, resourceful, etcetc. Good leader) WAR: 49 --> 65 (Extremely tall guy = scares you to death = winfite) INT: 90 --> 90 (good enough.) POL: 79 --> 82 (for successfully sucking up to lil Xian for Mengde) CHR: 58 --> 58 (lolwut?) E-E-End of post. |
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| scholar | Oct 29 2009, 07:02 PM Post #48 |
General
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You know... Cheng Yu saved Yan from Lu Bu's attack. Without him Cao Cao would be dead. |
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| KauSu | Oct 30 2009, 09:51 AM Post #49 |
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Ike's owner
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That is also quite scary. If I may add that. I might do a stat of the Three "Brothers" soon. Expect Zhang Fei to have the highest! because he's the only one that was really good of the three. Guan Yu's overrated and Liu Bei needs less WAR/POL and more LDR/INT. ;o EDIT: TYPO!!11one!!! Edited by KauSu, Oct 30 2009, 09:52 AM.
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SPECIAL MESSAGE FROM KAUSU: Me thinks that Ike should get ze Modship. Why so? It's pretty simple. I'll modestly point out why: - Friendliness and great charisma. - Excellent communication skills. - Is expert at using BOTH of his functional brain cells. [ End of message ] | |
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| scholar | Oct 31 2009, 06:40 AM Post #50 |
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Guan Yu's high stats are based off of the novel. You can want to change it but Guan Yu was a god among men in the fictional world of RTK. Liu Bei on the otherhand should be: LDR: 91 War:88 Int: 93 Pol:85 Cha:100 Tell me why he shouldn't have those stats? Spear: S Pike: S Bow: A Horse: B Weapon: B Navy: B |
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