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KOEI Warriors Lounge; Discuss what's on your mind.
Topic Started: Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:16 am (5,978,635 Views)
dancingswan
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In SW4, they portray Kagetora being the favorite and Kagekatsu coming off a bit jealous. Kinda cute.
Edited by dancingswan, Wed Apr 2, 2014 2:57 am.
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Mr. Kamikaze
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God of War
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SW5 Hypothetical story, Kagekatsu and Saburo get along, solidify the Uesugi strength, use Saburo's connection to the Hojo to form a Uesugi-Hojo Coalition against the Oda. :beard:

Best story ever.
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Jessica
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stan yuha.
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I really need to get back into DW/SW again.
I get so lost whenever you guys talk about it.
I actually forgot the names of like half of the SW characters oh my god
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DMRevolution
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Mr. Kamikaze
Wed Apr 2, 2014 2:58 am
SW5 Hypothetical story, Kagekatsu and Saburo get along, solidify the Uesugi strength, use Saburo's connection to the Hojo to form a Uesugi-Hojo Coalition against the Oda. :beard:

Best story ever.
Then Aya and Kai make out.
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Ryō Genken
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Disciplined Mind
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DMRevolution
Wed Apr 2, 2014 2:58 am
Mr. Kamikaze
Wed Apr 2, 2014 2:58 am
SW5 Hypothetical story, Kagekatsu and Saburo get along, solidify the Uesugi strength, use Saburo's connection to the Hojo to form a Uesugi-Hojo Coalition against the Oda. :beard:

Best story ever.
Then Aya and Kai make out.
Dangit DMR!
Now i don't want to see that what-if story in SW4XL or SW5!
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Uesugi Kenshin
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Mewshuji
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Looking into it, you're right on two parts: Both Aya supporting Kagetora and Kagetora being favored are only fables, not history backed with facts.

I kinda find it interesting you say Kagekatsu was the superior politician though. Kagetora managed to get not only his birth family on his side, but the Daibouji, the Date, and even the Takeda as well. Further, when Uesugi Norimasa asked for them to stop fighting, Kagetora was the one to show he wanted to end the conflict by sending his son to Kagekatsu as a hostage- and though there are conflicting opinions of how, his son did get killed.

Admittedly, Kagetora wasn't the best tactician, but I do believe he was the better politician.
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DMRevolution
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:hey:
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Deleted User
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i would really love a hypothetical story with the full Uesugi force facing against the Oda, could be amazing
especially since SW's hypothetical writing is always so much better than DW.
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DMRevolution
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If there is a Uesugi vs Oda, I want Danjo and Jinei. :asia:
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dancingswan
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I want a hypothetical Takeda story where it's actually about the Takeda.
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Mewshuji
Wed Apr 2, 2014 3:00 am
Looking into it, you're right on two parts: Both Aya supporting Kagetora and Kagetora being favored are only fables, not history backed with facts.

I kinda find it interesting you say Kagekatsu was the superior politician though. Kagetora managed to get not only his birth family on his side, but the Daibouji, the Date, and even the Takeda as well. Further, when Uesugi Norimasa asked for them to stop fighting, Kagetora was the one to show he wanted to end the conflict by sending his son to Kagekatsu as a hostage- and though there are conflicting opinions of how, his son did get killed.

Admittedly, Kagetora wasn't the best tactician, but I do believe he was the better politician.
Kagetora had political support but very little practical backing form any of those clans and Katsuyori definitely did not support KAgetora he supported KAgekatsu.
And while he was objectively a kinder person than Kagekatsu, sending his son to Kage was not a smart political move

and i think Kagekatsu's savyness and sheer beaurocratic competence later in the era proves he was a pretty smart politician. Its not like he managed to rebuild the Uesugi to their former glory and then become one of the five tairo over political incompetence.
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ChibiGingi
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Booyaka, Booyaka
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WHAT IS MY LIFE?

WHAT IS... oh, there's an entire box of Thin Mints...

I KNOW WHAT MY LIFE IS!
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Uesugi Kenshin
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Mewshuji
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Dear lord I just realized how the what-if Uesugi-Hojo coalition really is a fantastic idea. Once the Oda are defeated, it'd leave Western Japan. Northern Japan vs. Southern would at first seem like a retread of Sekigahara, but I think it has major potential to go another way.
No, Scottie, I guarantee you, looking at my sources, Katsuyori did support Kagetora. It was only for a short time though.

I do have to say I'm not trying to lessen Kagekatsu's achievements. I'm just trying to defend why I prefer Kagetora here. ;_;

Edit:... huh. I'm seeing conflicting reports here. This book I have, "Amassing Economies: The Medieval Origins of Early Modern Japan", blatantly states that Katsuyori supported Kagetora... but then, the Samurai Archives Wiki says that it was that Kagetora was considered as an option to support before Kagekatsu offered the Takeda some land. Very strange.
Edited by Uesugi Kenshin, Wed Apr 2, 2014 3:11 am.
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Deleted User
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he supported Kagekatsu though
thats like saying Yukimura supported the Tokugawa cause he served them for a day
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Mr. Kamikaze
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God of War
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Koei would find a way to shoehorn the Takeda into that Coalition though. They can't keep the Uesugi and Takeda separated for too long before they start to freak out.

Ideally, both Shingen and Kenshin would be dead by then ad the focus would be on Kagekatsu and Saburo (and Kai, Hayakawa, Kotaro, Kanetsugu, and Aya, probably, as well).
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Uesugi Kenshin
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Mewshuji
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Yeah, edited my post before I saw yours. Conflicting reports here. Blech.
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Mr. Kamikaze
Wed Apr 2, 2014 3:11 am
Koei would find a way to shoehorn the Takeda into that Coalition though.
they already did in SW3, they fought on Kagekatsu's side, because thats who they supported historically.
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NigelCollins24
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San Zang's Knight
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I'll like to see Yodo get into the series
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Uesugi Kenshin
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Mewshuji
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Mr. Kamikaze
Wed Apr 2, 2014 3:11 am
Koei would find a way to shoehorn the Takeda into that Coalition though. They can't keep the Uesugi and Takeda separated for too long before they start to freak out.

Ideally, both Shingen and Kenshin would be dead by then ad the focus would be on Kagekatsu and Saburo (and Kai, Hayakawa, Kotaro, Kanetsugu, and Aya, probably, as well).
Nobuyuki would be married to Ina who survived though the other Tokugawa retainers died, thus linking the Sanada to the Hojo as- surprise!- Ujiyasu adopts her! Kunoichi would tag along too. You just know that'd happen...
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Angelic Linca
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Blue Sunshine of Wei
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Sengoku History is a lot more confusing than the Three Kingdoms for being the more recent of the two.
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Uesugi Kenshin
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Mewshuji
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Yodo would be lovely but with Nene there and Hideyoshi's lechery and Nene's attempts to stop it being a focus of their relationship, she just wouldn't gel. Which is a shame because even though Nene did support her husband in his earlier years... it wasn't really to the extent of someone like Matsu. Not to mention Chacha/Yodo is an infinitely more interesting person.
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Deleted User
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i still cant fathom why they added nene in the first place
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Eni
BOOEH
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Waaaaaaaaaiting.
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DMRevolution
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Best part of the Uesugi Hojo Coalition.

Posted Image
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Mr. Kamikaze
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God of War
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DMRevolution
Wed Apr 2, 2014 3:17 am
Best part of the Uesugi Hojo Coalition.

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Old Man is the best man :okuni:
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