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Sengoku BASARA 3 (in NA: SB Samurai Heroes); Out in 2010 - PS3&Wii Multi!
Topic Started: Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:46 pm (399,228 Views)
murakumo
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Thanks MantaPunk. So will the clash feature deal damage to both sides then?

Also looking at the character page on the website and how much space is left in the PC half of it, if they don't spill onto what's left on the other side then it looks to be a 5x4 grid, about 20 playable characters. Not as many as we hoped for :/
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Mo Hae
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I really like Tsuruhime's deisgn.From her hair cut, to that kimono/dress thingy!She seems very innocent, but maybee a tough chick sorta?Does anyone know if she's been in any NHK dramas?I've never heard of her before, until know.

And the last part of her name is Hime?Soo, she's a princess?
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eklineage
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Lol it will be jokes if Ina is added in as a mech.. or it could be portrayed as a woman just wearing a high tech suit... with rocket boosters and junk.

Kinda like Alisa from Tekken 6. Well actually Alisa is actually a robot so ignore that part lol.
Edited by eklineage, Sat Jan 16, 2010 4:24 pm.
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Watchtower
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eklineage
Sat Jan 16, 2010 4:20 pm
Lol it will be jokes if Ina is added in as a mech.. or it could be portrayed as a woman just wearing a high tech suit... with rocket boosters and junk.

Kinda like Alisa from Tekken 6. Well actually Alisa is actually a robot so ignore that part lol.
I don't think Alisa would be the right choice for that comparison, considering that Alisa functions a lot like Tekken's version of the Terminator (whenever she says "Greetings, my name is Alisa. Prepare to be terminated." I start pulling off my best Shwartzeneggar impression. :lol: ). No, this connection's a bit more "obscure", but I would make Ina similar to Chachamaru from Negima!; a robot who looks like a regular girl on the outside, capable of expressing some human emotions but overall robotic (logical, statistical, etc.) in nature. And by "looks like a regular girl", I mean as far away from Tadakatsu's "covered completely in black armor with glow-light eye and gear sounds for vocals" as possible.
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Nghet
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Ina will be fine like Cos-Mos from Xenoxaga XD
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eklineage
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I can imagine hanzo's design for Basara. Metal Claws on his hands and feet with the metal nails that latch out and dig into the opponent. His element should be ... light? To conflict with Fuma's element of course.

As for Ina.. I would go with Kos-mos design rather than Chachamaru's

EDIT: Nvm... i thought Fuma's element was darkness... it's wind. I don't think Hanzo fits as a earth type though.
Edited by eklineage, Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:14 pm.
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Yedo
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Devilsking
Sat Jan 16, 2010 10:49 am
Well, it´s not that they are clones, but they share some things:

For example. Mitsunari, you can´t deny that he somewhat resembles Kenshin with his weapon. But even though he moves completely different, has a different element and outfit.

The quick purple slashes, the white hair/purple clothes, the follow Hideyoshi mentality and his darkness element...they seem to be taken from Hanbei.

So Mitsunari "resembles" Kenshin and Hanbei...but only cause he shares some things that remind you of them.

For Yoshitsugu, he kinda reminds me of Mitsuhide. It seems he has the darkness element, enjoys to see people suffering/dying and NDY said he has a pretty sick laugh. So even though they have different weapons and look different...that still reminds me of Mitsuhide.

So as for Kojuuro and Masamune.

They both share the lightning element. They both have a second S-String. They both have a "slashing"-BASARA (slashing means no big endings like Keiji´s whirling attack, Motonari´s sunshine attack at the end or no "special" BASARA´s like Shingen´s comet rain or Kenshin´s one shot freezing attack)
Also their skills often share the same purpose (launching them in the air + button press to launch a follow-up attack, landing multiple hits, dash forward, shoot lightning or activate their "second mode" while decreasing their defense)
So that´s why Kojuuro often reminds me of Masamune.

Though I still believe that there might be someone that could take over Kojuuro´s place even better.

Hakumei should know who I mean...there is a certain someone that still needs to challenge a certain someone who was said to have used a pretty long sword :ph43r:
I'm aware that Date and Kojuuro are similar, and also aware that they're clones in SB2. But they aren't nearly as similar as as say, Kenshin and Mitsunari (who share the same weapon and base fighting style), and Tokugawa and Hideyoshi (who share similar weapons and similar fighting styles). So I can't settle for Date. I've come to like Kojuuro's conventional style of swordplay. Date just won't satisfy me :lol:. Date's a swordsman, just not my kind of swordsman. Really, that's like choosing DMC's Dante over Vergil.

There are only two possibilities that would satisfy me: If Hisahide Matsunaga were made playable...I'd totally forget Kojuuro is an NPC. Or as you mention, the possibility of the famed Sasaki Kojiro making his debut in Samurai Heroes.



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Claus
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Hakumei
Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:44 pm
Devilsking
Sat Jan 16, 2010 10:49 am
Well, it´s not that they are clones, but they share some things:

For example. Mitsunari, you can´t deny that he somewhat resembles Kenshin with his weapon. But even though he moves completely different, has a different element and outfit.

The quick purple slashes, the white hair/purple clothes, the follow Hideyoshi mentality and his darkness element...they seem to be taken from Hanbei.

So Mitsunari "resembles" Kenshin and Hanbei...but only cause he shares some things that remind you of them.

For Yoshitsugu, he kinda reminds me of Mitsuhide. It seems he has the darkness element, enjoys to see people suffering/dying and NDY said he has a pretty sick laugh. So even though they have different weapons and look different...that still reminds me of Mitsuhide.

So as for Kojuuro and Masamune.

They both share the lightning element. They both have a second S-String. They both have a "slashing"-BASARA (slashing means no big endings like Keiji´s whirling attack, Motonari´s sunshine attack at the end or no "special" BASARA´s like Shingen´s comet rain or Kenshin´s one shot freezing attack)
Also their skills often share the same purpose (launching them in the air + button press to launch a follow-up attack, landing multiple hits, dash forward, shoot lightning or activate their "second mode" while decreasing their defense)
So that´s why Kojuuro often reminds me of Masamune.

Though I still believe that there might be someone that could take over Kojuuro´s place even better.

Hakumei should know who I mean...there is a certain someone that still needs to challenge a certain someone who was said to have used a pretty long sword :ph43r:
I'm aware that Date and Kojuuro are similar, and also aware that they're clones in SB2. But they aren't nearly as similar as as say, Kenshin and Mitsunari (who share the same weapon and base fighting style), and Tokugawa and Hideyoshi (who share similar weapons and similar fighting styles). So I can't settle for Date. I've come to like Kojuuro's conventional style of swordplay. Date just won't satisfy me :lol:. Date's a swordsman, just not my kind of swordsman. Really, that's like choosing DMC's Dante over Vergil.

There are only two possibilities that would satisfy me: If Hisahide Matsunaga were made playable...I'd totally forget Kojuuro is an NPC. Or as you mention, the possibility of the famed Sasaki Kojiro making his debut in Samurai Heroes.



Kenshin and Mitsunari both weild very diferent weapons. Kenshin wields an Odachi, while Mitsunari weilds an Iai. One is very long and used against Cavelry, one is used for defensive Iaijutsu. Though both use Iaijutsu, Kenshin uses Defensive Iaijutsu and Mitsunari Uses Offensive Iaijutsu, two styles that are quite diferent actually. They only share two things in common, Speed, and re-sheathing their weapon.

Just wanted to point that out.

But i have never Played as Kojuuro (never got a chance to get Heroes >_> ) so my opinion doesn't really matter. But i don't really accept Masamune as Kojuuro's replacement either. They have similarities, but i'm just not feeeling it myself.

Edited by Claus, Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:21 pm.
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HokutoNoBen
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Manta Punk
Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:32 am
Hakumei: The Masamune and the Kojuurou thing isn't as obvious as say the Mitsunari and Kenshin one. But, IIRC, HNB did a nice comparison between them both a while back. At first, I never really caught onto the similarities, but after reading that post, it kind of struck me.
Mmhmm. And here it is again, for the sake of the argument.

Me
myself and I

Well, take it from those who have; they are quite similar. Not to the degree of say, Sasuke and Kasuga, but you find that they do share a great deal in common.

Masamune and Kojuuro both have:
* A DMC-style "Stinger" Special

* Projectile Special; Masamune's is a big-ass fireball, while Kojuuro's is more akin to Chain Lighting that can travel between foes

* Launcher/Hightime like maneuver; they even both give you the option of just pressing the button to send opponents into the air, or holding the button so you can send Masamune/Kojuuro into the air after

* A temporary "Mode Change" special, which increases their offensive abilities, at the cost of sacrificing their defense


Again, they're not clones of each other, that much is true. But the styles are definitely still similar, nonetheless.


DK takes care of the last detail, with them both having a sort of "Ranbu" like BASARA attack.


I'd like to think that, the time away may be good for Kojuuro. They could stand to reinvent him a bit, and make it so he could have even more to separate him from Masamune.

Frankly, at this point, this is what I wish for a lot of the people who are "gone" at the moment. Sasuke, Kasuga, Kenshin, the Oda bunch and even my boys, Hideyoshi and Hanbei. A lot of the newbies are thus far, doing a lot to portray that they outclass the older playstyles that the veterans had in the PS2 era (and in Kotaro's case, he was more fun to play with than either of the first two Ninjas, any way).

So, here's hoping this trend continues.
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Watchtower
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eklineage
Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:09 pm
I can imagine hanzo's design for Basara. Metal Claws on his hands and feet with the metal nails that latch out and dig into the opponent. His element should be ... light? To conflict with Fuma's element of course.

As for Ina.. I would go with Kos-mos design rather than Chachamaru's

EDIT: Nvm... i thought Fuma's element was darkness... it's wind. I don't think Hanzo fits as a earth type though.
Well, I was more using the Chachamaru reference 'cause I forgot about Kos-Mos and I needed something to counter Tekken's Alisa. Of course I would prefer Ina to be similar to Kos-Mos. She should have some robot parts, but should be shown as a cyborg, a "half-n-half", in contrast to Tasakatsu's full-robot appearance.
Edited by Watchtower, Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:59 pm.
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eklineage
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Watchtower
Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:59 pm
eklineage
Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:09 pm
I can imagine hanzo's design for Basara. Metal Claws on his hands and feet with the metal nails that latch out and dig into the opponent. His element should be ... light? To conflict with Fuma's element of course.

As for Ina.. I would go with Kos-mos design rather than Chachamaru's

EDIT: Nvm... i thought Fuma's element was darkness... it's wind. I don't think Hanzo fits as a earth type though.
Well, I was more using the Chachamaru reference 'cause I forgot about Kos-Mos and I needed something to counter Tekken's Alisa. Of course I would prefer Ina to be similar to Kos-Mos. She should have some robot parts, but should be shown as a cyborg, a "half-n-half", in contrast to Tasakatsu's full-robot appearance.
Ina's element shouldn't be lightning despite Mr.Iron Ox being that element. There are too many lightning users atm. We have no light users. The only wind user we have is Keiji. I've heard from someone here that Tsuru is ice. I think we also have one darkness which is Mitshida lol... and yes I combined the two words on purpose cuz im lazy.

I suspect Oichi will appear in Basara 3 with a daughter...or triplets cuz Go Go Power Ranger apparently had 3 daughters.
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Yedo
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Xanxus
Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:21 pm
Kenshin and Mitsunari both weild very diferent weapons. Kenshin wields an Odachi, while Mitsunari weilds an Iai. One is very long and used against Cavelry, one is used for defensive Iaijutsu. Though both use Iaijutsu, Kenshin uses Defensive Iaijutsu and Mitsunari Uses Offensive Iaijutsu, two styles that are quite diferent actually. They only share two things in common, Speed, and re-sheathing their weapon.

Just wanted to point that out.

But i have never Played as Kojuuro (never got a chance to get Heroes >_> ) so my opinion doesn't really matter. But i don't really accept Masamune as Kojuuro's replacement either. They have similarities, but i'm just not feeeling it myself.

I suppose that Kenshin's weapon can be classified as an Odachi as well. And I really don't see how their use against cavalry fits into this as both their weapons seem to function just the same against all enemies.

Kenshin may use a defensive style while Mitsunari uses an offensive style of Iaijutsu. My point is that it's the same base style of Iaijutsu. Iaijutsu is their foundation, they just have different ways of utilizing it.

As for the Kojuuro and Date comparison. Yes, from a gameplay standpoint they do have some moves that function quite similarly, if not the same. But that's really looking at it broadly. You could very well say the same for many fighting game characters as many do share projectile moves, anti-air moves, grapples, etc.

Looking at these characters, Date and Kojuuro from a design standpoint however, they really are more different than they are the same. Personality wise, fighting style wise, plot-wise. etc.

Anyway, I don't really feel like discussing this any further. I'm fine with Kojuuro being an NPC as I'm betting there will be enough characters to fill his gap. Even more so if Matsunaga or Kojiro are confirmed playable characters.
Edited by Yedo, Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:43 pm.
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eklineage
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So far all the movesets have been better than their counterparts
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Claus
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Hakumei
 
I suppose that Kenshin's weapon can be classified as an Odachi as well.

:l You suppose? Aswell? No, his weapon is an Odachi, its nothing else and nothing more.
Hakumei
 
And I really don't see how their use against cavalry fits into this as both their weapons seem to function just the same against all enemies.

Odachis were used against cavalry. Thats how it fits into this. Just because Kenshin's move set doesn't change when he encounters Cavalry doesn't mean Odachis aren't used specifically against them.
Hakumei
 
Kenshin may use a defensive style while Mitsunari uses an offensive style of Iaijutsu. My point is that it's the same base style of Iaijutsu. Iaijutsu is their foundation, they just have different ways of utilizing it.

You obviously did not understand the point of my post. Defensive Iaijutsu and Offensive Iaijutsu are both two diferent styles, i'm talking IRL! They are actually two diferent styles, and Kenshin and Mitsunari use them respectively. Defensive Iaijutsu consits of very little movement (kenshin) and it relies on keeping the enemy away from you. Offensive Iaijutsu consists of lots of movement to one up the enemy. Defensive Iaijutsu is Kenshin's foundation, Mitsunari's foundation is Offensive Iaijutsu. They're two diferent styles and foundations, they only share the same core, which is speed.


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Manta Punk
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Hakumei
Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:38 pm
Looking at these characters, Date and Kojuuro from a design standpoint however, they really are more different than they are the same. Personality wise, fighting style wise, plot-wise. etc.

Exactly, and I think thats what irritates most of us when people wander in here and whine how the new characters are basically just cut outs of the past ones. From a first gander at them, they look to play similar to the side-line veterans, but from a personality, plot-wise and fighting style standpoint, I'll bet anything they'll be different. Xanxus gave us a decent analysis of the differences in Kenshin's and Mitsunari's play style.

Ieyasu and Hideyoshi - I'm really not seeing it. They fight with their bare fists, but the only similar moves we've seen is the rapid punches. Ieyasu appears to fight like a boxer, while Hideyoshi takes the classic Capcom grappler play style. Heck, it seems Kanbei may be our Hideyoshi "clone" more so than Ieyasu, with his SPD skill.

Maggie and Nou - This one is more clearer, but we've yet to see how Maggie truly plays (apart from NDY). She seems to have different fire arms than Nou, even using grenades. Still, just because they each use a variety of fire arms, doesn't mean their "clones".

Yoshitsugu and Kanbei seem to sport thier own unique move-sets (apart from the skil mentioned above), and we haven't really got that much info on Tsuru.

Anyway, that was mostly dedicated to the newbies who come raging in here about Capcom being lazy and just recycling the old characters. Plus, I've said it many times, but it must be difficult to create a totally unique play style for a roster soon to be pushing 50. Especially since BASARA's flashyness is one of its main things, and to keep the craziness consistent, they'll have to have some similarities in character move-sets.

I understand about your problem though, Hakumei. Kojuurou uses more traditional attacks, while Masamune goes for a more stylish take. Still, I'm hoping these "cloned" characters are the Kojuurou for thier counterparts Masamune. Playing similar, but yet have traits that define them as individuals, especially in future titles, where all of the roster should be playable.

Thats my only gripe, people calling them "clones". "Replacments" is better, as it appears that they'll appeal to people who've lost their favourite and can now play a character similar, but it still doesn't feel right calling them that :ph43r:
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DarkMantisTalon
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kenshin and yoshimoto have the same moveset??
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Claus
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DarkMantisTalon
Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:27 am
kenshin and yoshimoto have the same moveset??
What the heck are you talking about? :blink:

@Manta Punk: Exactly, these characters are more replacements for those who miss their favourite character's playing style. Its bassicaaly like, "Hey, if you like Kenshin, you will love Mitsunari!" They aren't carbon copies with an updated move set.
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Ultimate Legend
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DarkMantisTalon
Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:27 am
kenshin and yoshimoto have the same moveset??
I'm not really sure of what you're asking, but Yoshimoto (And Motonari in SB1) was a half clone of Kenshin. He shares the first 4 attacks but the last 4 are different.
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DarkMantisTalon
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ohh ok
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eklineage
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/facepalm

Walls of text over Masamasa and Kojukoju. *folds arms with squinted eyes and raised eyebrow*
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Yedo
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Quote:
 
:l You suppose? Aswell? No, his weapon is an Odachi, its nothing else and nothing more.
Really...I don't see why you're going to get technical with this. You can't say for certain what Kenshin's sword is. Unless you have the actual databook measurements of each of Kenshin's weapons, then I might agree that it is for certain an odachi. But as far as I know, official measurements don't exist, so you can only go by how long it looks. In fact, I'm pretty sure Capcom states his weapon to be a Katana.

Quote:
 
Odachis were used against cavalry. Thats how it fits into this. Just because Kenshin's move set doesn't change when he encounters Cavalry doesn't mean Odachis aren't used specifically against them.
I never denied that odachi were used against cavalry. My point is that you can't use this to support your argument that Kenshin's weapon IS an odachi mainly because he doesn't use it any differently upon opponents on horseback than on opponents on foot.

Quote:
 
You obviously did not understand the point of my post. Defensive Iaijutsu and Offensive Iaijutsu are both two diferent styles, i'm talking IRL! They are actually two diferent styles, and Kenshin and Mitsunari use them respectively. Defensive Iaijutsu consits of very little movement (kenshin) and it relies on keeping the enemy away from you. Offensive Iaijutsu consists of lots of movement to one up the enemy. Defensive Iaijutsu is Kenshin's foundation, Mitsunari's foundation is Offensive Iaijutsu. They're two diferent styles and foundations, they only share the same core, which is speed.
I don't understand the point of your post? Really? I'm pretty sure I said that Iaijutsu is the foundation of their styles. Which is pretty much what you said: "They only share the same core." That's pretty much what I'm saying...When I say they share the same foundation of Iaijutsu, I mean that Iaijutsu is the core of their fighting styles. You can say their fighting styles are offensive or defensive, it really doesn't matter. Their styles are derived from Iaijutsu. Offensive Iaijutsu or Defensive Iaijutsu, it's still Iaijutsu!

And really, to state which style is either offensive or defensive is rather subjective. As far as I know, you can play Kenshin offensively or defensively, and I'm very certain that you can do the same for Mitsunari. And this game has very little to do with real life to begin with. In the end, Kenshin and Mitsunari's fighting styles are mere fantasy. You're not going to find a fighting style in real life that'll teach you to fight like Mitsunari or Kenshin, I guarantee it. No one can rapidly draw and sheath their sword in the manner that those 2 characters do.

On a final note. I'm certain that we lost track of our argument. First it was about replacement characters, now we've strayed to the tangent of Kenshin's weapon and his fighting style. I'm going to withdraw without another word on this. I really have no problem with "replacement" characters. In fact, I'm pretty excited on Capcom's take on these characters, particularly Tokugawa and Saika. It erks me that Kojuuro is gone, but I'm pretty sure that the upcoming characters will fill the gap. Date of course doesn't compensate for his absence still, lol.
Edited by Yedo, Sun Jan 17, 2010 2:55 am.
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eklineage
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Dammit i wish they would give us silhouettes.. or the names of the new characters so we can guess how they will look like. The good part is... I'll have apple pie in the morning to get over the loss. And some bed activities.
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murakumo
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Quote:
 
The good part is... I'll have apple pie in the morning to get over the loss. And some bed activities.


Didn't need to know that thank you. <_<

But we already know that Yoshiaki will be a character. I don't know why we have no sillouhettes, maybe they're choosing to scrap that and just make it more of a surprise.
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BlackKite
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長宗我部菜々

Or maybe it could be that the next character to be revealed is.... Mogami Yoshiaki himself??? :ph43r:
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ChrisX
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Okay... so what's the percentage of the rosters that have been revealed, with Kanbei and Tsuru included?
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