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Dynasty Warriors 7 [v4]; READ the first post before posting.
Topic Started: Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:32 am (1,039,717 Views)
Benzod
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All Tai'd Up
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Joetri10
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:04 pm
No... A cut is someone whos not in the game and doesnt have a role in the story.

A Unpc is someone who has everything a playable character has, but is just not playable.

Do you want me to point you to the Sw Npcs again.. orrrr?.. -_-
Well with the new weapon system in DW7, ie. equiping anyone with any weapons, then they might as well be playable. Even if they don't get movesets or weapons specific to them, there's still no reason to have them completely unplayable.

Making UNPCs will also invariably make people want to play as them. So there's no real way to justify it at this stage.

The thing KOEI should do to give them more time on the gameplay improvement side is to add less characters. A handful each game is fine, the main reason behind the 16 we've gotten this time is the timeline extension. Or better yet stop redesigning the current cast, leave them as they are and work more on how they play rather than how they look.
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Xiuzhao
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saner, how old are you? Because your posts make you look like an immature 12 year old; either that or a very good troll. Cut out the rude use of smileys and cut out the condescending attitude; Please.

I can't even bring myself to argue with you because you are so irritating.
Edited by Xiuzhao, Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:36 pm.
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Ranger Strider
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saner
Sat Feb 5, 2011 8:55 pm
TrevorxTravesty
Sat Feb 5, 2011 8:40 pm
Damn...Look at all the rage going on in here! Utter chaos, I tell ya! But, I gotta say...Koei is KNOWN for having a huge cast of characters! And all of them have their own distinct personalities & quirks. Look what happened when people got nixed from DW6! There was an uproar! I mean, I swear the Qiao fans nearly went to war!
Yes it is a good thing Koei is redeeming themselves this time and providing a greater selection of characters for a bigger audience of different tastes and demand bigger diversity of playable character designs, returning favorites, new favorites, and weapons to mix and match,

instead of listening to 'clone whiners', 'UNPC fools' and 'ROTK preachers' that don't know what's best for the series at all. :)
I third this! Haha!

Hey Koei's recycling maps so obvious they're learning how to make things easier for themselves(Either that or they're fixing DW6's mistakes).
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LLSmoothJ
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Benzod
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:32 pm
The thing KOEI should do to give them more time on the gameplay improvement side is to add less characters. A handful each game is fine, the main reason behind the 16 we've gotten this time is the timeline extension. Or better yet stop redesigning the current cast, leave them as they are and work more on how they play rather than how the look.
THIS! Especially the bolded.

Really, there's no reason why they should change character designs within each installment. Stages? Maybe, but that time could go to the characters themselves and expanding on movesets so we don't even have to worry about regulating characters to NPC status.

The idea of demoting characters to NPCs is annoying. I couldn't count how many times I wanted to play as certain characters in SB3 only to find that they were just NPCs. Either way, just NPC-ing characters would just be lazy.

And besides, we haven't really seen how Kingdom Mode and Chronicle/Conquest Mode will work in DW7 yet, so we should just be patient until the game come out.

Edited by LLSmoothJ, Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:41 pm.
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
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saner
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:19 pm
Joetri10
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:04 pm
No... A cut is someone whos not in the game and doesnt have a role in the story.

A Unpc is someone who has everything a playable character has, but is just not playable.

Do you want me to point you to the Sw Npcs again.. orrrr?.. -_-
UNPCS are still basically useless to the player. Stories are commonly only watched once, but replayable characters are far more valuable and give more reasons to play.

Story can do so much to keep interest, usually after the first time, players really depend on the playable selection to keep things fun.

And the less playable characters, the less fun. You might think a certain character is minor and useless in the story, but to someone else, they could be their favorites to use in the gameplay.

the majority of people buy and keep playing these games for the gameplay first and the selection of characters.

So if there are less characters and favorites to choose from, that means they will get bored faster.

UNPCS are not going to add fun and more selection to the gameplay.

:meantongue:


A character, whom i can't play anymore, is a cut one for me. What does that do for me, when i clash with a, let's say,....hmmmmm....., yeah, with a "degraded to UNPC"-Wei Yan.
I would be soooooooo pissed of. It would be like having a girlfriend like Megan Fox, but you can't "touch" her.
In SW, everytime i clashed with, let's say,.....hmmmmmm....., yeah, with Kojiro Sazaki, i wished he would become a UPC. The same goes for Katsuie Shibata, Nagamaza Azai, Ieyasu Tokugawa and all the others. And what have Koei done? They made them UPC, and won maybe more fans and earned even more praise. But then, they cut out a few, like Kojiro Sazaki, Musashi Miyamoto, or even Kennyo Honganji from SW1. Maybe because they sent one spy to this forum, who did read posts like yours, and reported it to Koei as the wishes of the most fans. But they messed up with their decisions by doing that. I guess over 80% of the fans were disappointed, when Koei did cut out these unique warriors.

And again @ saner: Are you sent from God?
Edited by ThreeKingdomsWarrior, Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:44 pm.
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Flashbang Incentive
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Alright, the only thing that kinds ticks me off is the lack of gameplay. Where is it?
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Xiuzhao
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Apparently there's going to be another PV released this coming week. Hopefully that's true and hopefully we get to see plenty more gameplay. I'd rather see straight up gameplay instead of the video we got before.
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JayHawk
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jsully16
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:30 pm
I don't really care enough to read back at what's been discussed the last 30 pages, as it sounds like it was nothing but beating a dead horse (NORRRRR CLOAAAAAANSSSSS!!!!!! seriously guys? clones again?)

Anyway, I'm totally for the 4 character idea.

Shu - Liu Bei, Guan Yu, Zhao Yun, Zhuge Liang
Wei - Cao Cao, Zhang Liao, Xiahou Dun, Sima Yi
Wu - Sun Ce, Sun Quan, Zhou Yu, Lu Meng/Xun
Jin - Sima Zhao, Deng Ai, Zhong Hui, Du Yu

Give them all insanely awesome stories. Give them real personalities. Won't happen though.
That would be a good idea actually, but for a completely different Dynasty Warriors game.... It would be called "Dynasty Warriors Chronicles" or something...

And in my opinion, I'd have it with 5 characters each.

Shu: Liu Bei, Guan Yu, Zhang Fei, Zhuge Liang, Zhao Yun/Ma Chao.
Wei: Cao Cao, Xu Huang, Zhang Liao, Zhang He, Sima Yi.
Wu: Sun Quan, Taishi Ci, Zhou Yu, Lu Meng, Lu Xun.
Jin: Sima Shi, Sima Zhao, Deng Ai, Zhong Hui, Guo Huai.
Other: Lu Bu, Diao Chan, Yuan Shao.
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necrosis
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Benzod
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:32 pm
Well with the new weapon system in DW7, ie. equiping anyone with any weapons, then they might as well be playable. Even if they don't get movesets or weapons specific to them, there's still no reason to have them completely unplayable.

This is why I see not including Pang De as pointless. Just clone him to Zhang Liao. How hard is it give him a musou attack and an ex attack and some dialog at Tong and Fan?
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Reverie
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Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:49 pm
Apparently there's going to be another PV released this coming week. Hopefully that's true and hopefully we get to see plenty more gameplay. I'd rather see straight up gameplay instead of the video we got before.
Well they did say on twitter it's going to be out next week, it should be true. I also agree they should just show more gameplay.
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JayHawk
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Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:49 pm
Apparently there's going to be another PV released this coming week. Hopefully that's true and hopefully we get to see plenty more gameplay. I'd rather see straight up gameplay instead of the video we got before.
I agree completely... Last PV was more of just a "this is what the game will be like" video... I just want to see gameplay! Liu Bei, Lu Bu, or Ma Dai this time.
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
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Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:35 pm
saner, how old are you? Because your posts make you look like an immature 12 year old; either that or a very good troll. Cut out the rude use of smileys and cut out the condescending attitude; Please.

I can't even bring myself to argue with you because you are so irritating.
Don't get me wrong man. But you sound like a 72 year old. Nearly the most posts of yours sounds "grumpy" :lol: . At least the ones, i've read the last.
And better change your avatar :D . I mean, really, it looks too challenging. It looks like, it is saying: "Come on man, show me what you got, you have no chance against me, i'll show you, i have the power."
Besides, who is the guy in your avatar?


MOD EDIT: Let's try to stay away from the personal arguments here, mmkay? This topic's solely for DW7 speculation/discussion.
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JayHawk
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:12 pm
Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:35 pm
saner, how old are you? Because your posts make you look like an immature 12 year old; either that or a very good troll. Cut out the rude use of smileys and cut out the condescending attitude; Please.

I can't even bring myself to argue with you because you are so irritating.
Don't get me wrong man. But you sound like a 72 year old. Nearly the most posts of yours sounds "grumpy" :lol: . At least the ones, i've read the last.
And better change your avatar :D . I mean, really, it looks too challenging. It looks like, it is saying: "Come on man, show me what you got, you have no chance against me, i'll show you, i have the power."
Besides, who is the guy in your avatar?
Actually, I think his avatar fits him XD It's Niu Jin. Speaking of Avatars.... I should change mine.... I'm getting tired of looking at Ma Teng....

OT: So.... I can't wait to see what weapon Guan Suo will have... I can see him using a polearm, like Lu Meng.
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Liu Bei 7
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:12 pm
Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:35 pm
saner, how old are you? Because your posts make you look like an immature 12 year old; either that or a very good troll. Cut out the rude use of smileys and cut out the condescending attitude; Please.

I can't even bring myself to argue with you because you are so irritating.
Don't get me wrong man. But you sound like a 72 year old. Nearly the most posts of yours sounds "grumpy" :lol: . At least the ones, i've read the last.
And better change your avatar :D . I mean, really, it looks too challenging. It looks like, it is saying: "Come on man, show me what you got, you have no chance against me, i'll show you, i have the power."
Besides, who is the guy in your avatar?
It's Niu Jin.

Edit: Beat me to it. And by the way, this hasn't been discussed lately, but going off yesterday, has Koei hinted at there being a "secret" character? People were talking like it might happen.
Edited by Liu Bei 7, Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:16 pm.
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SimaYi11
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Officer
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Benzod
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:32 pm
Joetri10
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:04 pm
No... A cut is someone whos not in the game and doesnt have a role in the story.

A Unpc is someone who has everything a playable character has, but is just not playable.

Do you want me to point you to the Sw Npcs again.. orrrr?.. -_-
Well with the new weapon system in DW7, ie. equiping anyone with any weapons, then they might as well be playable. Even if they don't get movesets or weapons specific to them, there's still no reason to have them completely unplayable.

Making UNPCs will also invariably make people want to play as them. So there's no real way to justify it at this stage.

The thing KOEI should do to give them more time on the gameplay improvement side is to add less characters. A handful each game is fine, the main reason behind the 16 we've gotten this time is the timeline extension. Or better yet stop redesigning the current cast, leave them as they are and work more on how they play rather than how they look.
Not to lash out but I personally think thats an awlful idea. We shouldn't have to sacrafice style for substance. Dynasty Warriors for all its merits is not managed properly. We should have redesigns, new characters and better game mechanics in a game. Its not too much to ask of Koei but like any company they do as little as they have to. But its not a good idea to forgo style for better gameplay when both should be top priorities. The company just needs to start listening to its fans plain and simple.
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Lord Grazzle
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Lol I know why they don't show gameplay... because it's the same every installment havn't you guys realised that yet?!? xD. Honestly.. the difference between gameplay in DW2 and DW7 is well.. 2 weapons and another musou bar. The mechanics are basically the same.. So they show off gameplay it will look the same. Show off whats different? Modes, Characters + designs, Stages, Slight improvement in graphics... Will make the game more attractive. Why am I buying it if I think it's the same game? Well yes it is the same game more or less with the mechanics... but it's a 'refreshing' experience in terms of Modes, Story and Characters etc. Well £29.99 for soo many more hours of entertainment is worth it if you ask me seeing as a cinema ticket costs £5. Not that finance is a problem.. ;)

EDIT: No it hasn't been confirmed of that price but every Dynasty Warriors game I've seen has been below £30 brand new on amazon.co.uk from amazon not private sellers.
Edited by Lord Grazzle, Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:19 pm.
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Wild Lion
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What have I started? XD

First of all, I didn't say cut any characters. Just stop adding new ones and focus on improving the ones we have now.

While it's a shame to have less characters to play as, it's also a shame that every one of those 62 characters plays pretty much the same (every C3 is crowd clearing move, every C4 is a throw, etc)

And to who said this
Quote:
 
Story can do so much to keep interest, usually after the first time, players really depend on the playable selection to keep things fun.

And the less playable characters, the less fun.


Then tell me how Devil May Cry is still insanely fun after beating it multiple times? There's only one playable character, so it can't possibly be fun after playing with that one, right? The difference is that Devil May Cry has deep and diverse gameplay within Dante that offers lots of possibilities with just that one character. The people you're arguing with simply want the characters in DW to have that same kind of deep gameplay and multiple branches.

But I think what you guys agreeing with me don't understand, is that many DW fans, such as you see here, are mostly concerned with playing as their favorite characters period. Doesn't really matter if they're a clone, they just want to control the pretty guy or the cute girl of their dreams. You define a unique character by how different their moveset and playstyle is, these people define a unique character by how different their costume and personality are. So no matter how much the battle system is improved, if their favorite character is not playable then they'll call the game trash and an utter failure.

All I'm saying is that for a game or two, instead of adding more costumes and more cutscenes and more characters, they should instead focus on adding more to the fighting system (not taking away from it like Renbu) and beefing it up to make the game itself more fun to play for non-DW-fans, and each character very different to play as. And no, I don't consider a character to be different just because he's a different personality if I can press the same combinations of buttons to win as I did for another character.

Quote:
 
I've gone 100% on Dynasty Warriors 5. All of my characters are Max level, have their multiple weapons, I have all the precious items, and I've beaten every stage and musou level on Chaos. Playing Dynasty Warriors 5 would accomplish nothing.


This post proves my point exactly. Without all those modes and stories to beat, the gameplay of DW is boring. It's not even fun enough to make a hardcore fan go back and play it just for the fun of playing it. You play it for Achievements, pretty much. And to to me, if a game isn't fun to play just to play it, without rewards and unlockables, then it's not a very well made game at all.

The reason Madden games and FPS games keep selling is because they don't need unlockables or different characters to be fun. The games are fun to play by themselves because every time you play something different happens. A new situation arises that you have to think through, just because that's the nature of the games. The nature of DW as of now is repetition. Use C3 over and over again, and it works every time, every stage. Nothing new pops up that makes C3 useless and makes you think of a new way to do things. DW never makes you think, or get creative, or experiment. That's why it gets bad reviews, because every time you play a DW you know exactly what to expect and exactly what to do.
Edited by Wild Lion, Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:44 pm.
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Joetri10
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:12 pm
Xiuzhao
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:35 pm
saner, how old are you? Because your posts make you look like an immature 12 year old; either that or a very good troll. Cut out the rude use of smileys and cut out the condescending attitude; Please.

I can't even bring myself to argue with you because you are so irritating.
Don't get me wrong man. But you sound like a 72 year old. Nearly the most posts of yours sounds "grumpy" :lol: . At least the ones, i've read the last.
And better change your avatar :D . I mean, really, it looks too challenging. It looks like, it is saying: "Come on man, show me what you got, you have no chance against me, i'll show you, i have the power."
Besides, who is the guy in your avatar?


MOD EDIT: Let's try to stay away from the personal arguments here, mmkay? This topic's solely for DW7 speculation/discussion.
As they gave an half answer... yes the character is Niu Jin... A lot of users (mainly sophisticated people) have them as there avatar because i think they come from KOEI Warriors: Conquerors or any other Role playing thing... As for the avatar itself, it’s from the (koei) game Romance of the Three Kingdoms XI.

Its a very sophisticated game in my opinion.. Its not that bad either

:ot: :XD
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Paragon of Light
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I would be for about 30 characters or around that number. 16 seems a bit too narrow for the large cast the the three kingdoms had. And rendering them as unpc would seem like an insult somewhat but ill put which characters should be in there.

For 30

Wei: Cao Cao, Sima Yi, Zhang Liao, Cao Ren, Xiahou Ba, Xiahou Dun.
Shu: Liu Bei, Guan Yu, Zhang Fei, Zhuge Liang, Zhao Yun, Jiang Wei
Wu: Sun Ce, Zhou Yu, Lu Meng, Lu Xun, Sxx, Lu Kang.
Jin: Sima Zhao, Deng Ai, Zhoug Hui, Du Yu.
Other: Lu Bu, Diao Chan.

But this probably should be for a spin-off. Focus more on the generals who actually did stuff and I added two females just for the sake of it. And like
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Pride
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Question, is this really the confirmed roster? or should we expect more characters revealed?
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CloudJJ
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Lord Grazzle
Sat Feb 5, 2011 10:17 pm
Lol I know why they don't show gameplay... because it's the same every installment havn't you guys realised that yet?!? xD. Honestly.. the difference between gameplay in DW2 and DW7 is well.. 2 weapons and another musou bar. The mechanics are basically the same.. So they show off gameplay it will look the same. Show off whats different? Modes, Characters + designs, Stages, Slight improvement in graphics... Will make the game more attractive. Why am I buying it if I think it's the same game? Well yes it is the same game more or less with the mechanics... but it's a 'refreshing' experience in terms of Modes, Story and Characters etc. Well £29.99 for soo many more hours of entertainment is worth it if you ask me seeing as a cinema ticket costs £5. Not that finance is a problem.. ;)

EDIT: No it hasn't been confirmed of that price but every Dynasty Warriors game I've seen has been below £30 brand new on amazon.co.uk from amazon not private sellers.
Well it would be the same. You can say that for CoD, Fable, Halo, any game.

To be honest this looks like its an awesome game and cause I played 1 - 6 why not get 7? Most people who played all of it would as well
^^ But as you said its refreshing and tbh Any DW is fun. Will be great! ( Though DW2 is my fav, hopefully this game will make me reconsider!)
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ThreeKingdomsWarrior
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@ Bluuejay: So this is Niu Jin. I know him. Cao Ren saved that guy. And yours is Ma Teng? Not bad. But i want to see him next in DW as a UPC, not as an avatar :D .
About Guan Suo's weapon. A polearm? Hmmmmm, maybe. I wonder more, if he'll get a weapon-type we don't know already.

@ Liu Bei 7: Sorry, no. There is nothing like that confirmed. Fans here had just speculated/wished, that Koei could reveal one in their last batch of scans.

@ Joetri10: I would have played that ROTK-Games very gladly. But they didn't come to EU. At least not in the country i'm living.
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saner
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jsully16
Sat Feb 5, 2011 9:30 pm

Anyway, I'm totally for the 4 character idea.

Shu - Liu Bei, Guan Yu, Zhao Yun, Zhuge Liang
Wei - Cao Cao, Zhang Liao, Xiahou Dun, Sima Yi
Wu - Sun Ce, Sun Quan, Zhou Yu, Lu Meng/Xun
Jin - Sima Zhao, Deng Ai, Zhong Hui, Du Yu

ugh. Would rather play Warriors Orochi 2 again instead of wasting money on that roster. >.<
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Pandemonium
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I have a small question

Is there ant special, limited, or collector's edition for the game ( American or European version) ?
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SimaYi11
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Something else I considerd today was that DW3 seemed better to me than some of the other games for one reason. The characters moved somewhat slower but the since of impact felt much better than any game since. Does anyone else know what I mean? I don't know why but the force behind blows seemed more gratifing.I'm hoping to see this in DW7
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