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Dynasty Warriors 7 [v5] (SPOILERS); SPOILERS BEWARE! GAMEPLAY VIDEOS/INFO INSIDE!
Topic Started: Thu Feb 17, 2011 3:01 pm (735,373 Views)
Kurokawa_Tadayoshi
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The one with hidden potential
[ *  * ]
SilentNinja
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:17 pm
Deng Ai
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:10 pm
Oh this is just great!

So instead of logical choices, Koei resorts to overhyping certain characters?
I do like Dun a lot, don't be mistaken, but I don't want him to hug all the limelight.
Fan Castle has always been a battle of Guan Yu vs Cao Ren (and Lu Meng sorta).
So why would you have Xiahou Dun fight this battle for Wei?

And Xu Huang is left out yet again? Damn, I can smell the Wei hate and Shu love.
6th part and still only 3 of the 5 Wei Generals and out of them only 2 appearantly
have a significant role to play.....

While I expect that all the Tiger Generals will be in Kingdom Mode....

And Guan Suo instead of Guan Ping? Seriously, buzz off with that fictional piece of
crap!
It wasn't that...they went with the Guan Yu/Xiahou Dun Drama again. Despite the fact that Xu Huang has more story on his friendship with Guan Yu than Yuanrang's jealousy.

You expect me , a shuist to see this as Shu love? That's atrocious x.x

EDIT: I don't care about Guan Suo compare to Ping, but at least he can fit the Yi Ling story. *Puts the Guan ping x Xing Cai fanclub sign*
Meh, the Shu Love is more of a personal opinion because of the unbelieve that Yue Jin and Yu Jin still haven't been included :(

And the whole YuDun drama is kinda cool and all, but it's hardly fair to have Cao Ren lose his stage for it.....

As for the Ping-Suo issue, I just don't hope Ping is not getting a stage at all :unsure:
Edited by Kurokawa_Tadayoshi, Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:26 pm.
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Shadowclaimer
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General who Pacifies the Fools
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Deng Ai
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:25 pm
SilentNinja
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:17 pm
Deng Ai
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:10 pm
Oh this is just great!

So instead of logical choices, Koei resorts to overhyping certain characters?
I do like Dun a lot, don't be mistaken, but I don't want him to hug all the limelight.
Fan Castle has always been a battle of Guan Yu vs Cao Ren (and Lu Meng sorta).
So why would you have Xiahou Dun fight this battle for Wei?

And Xu Huang is left out yet again? Damn, I can smell the Wei hate and Shu love.
6th part and still only 3 of the 5 Wei Generals and out of them only 2 appearantly
have a significant role to play.....

While I expect that all the Tiger Generals will be in Kingdom Mode....

And Guan Suo instead of Guan Ping? Seriously, buzz off with that fictional piece of
crap!
It wasn't that...they went with the Guan Yu/Xiahou Dun Drama again. Despite the fact that Xu Huang has more story on his friendship with Guan Yu than Yuanrang's jealousy.

You expect me , a shuist to see this as Shu love? That's atrocious x.x

EDIT: I don't care about Guan Suo compare to Ping, but at least he can fit the Yi Ling story. *Puts the Guan ping x Xing Cai fanclub sign*
Meh, the Shu Love is more of a personal opinion because of the unbelieve that Yue Jin and Yu Jin
still haven't been included :(

And the whole YuDun drama is kinda cool and all, but it's hardly fair to have Cao Ren lose his
stage for it.....

As for the Ping-Suo issue, I just don't hope Ping is not getting a stage at all :unsure:
Yea that'd be part of my fear, I don't necessarily like Guan Ping but stubbing him of his role for the past few games in favor of his squeaky brother because he's new is a bit.. drastic.
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The Outsider
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The Demon's Rival
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
Very good point, It's the one for me I don't get either -_- . I really like Dun, but the only reason that was done was because it's the last stage for Wei, and they didn't want it ending with characters who're just about to get their highlights but haven't had a huge impact beforehand. Koei were just playing safe, that's all, but instead, playing safe has angered people. If there was another stage for Wei after Fan Castle, I have no doubt Cao Ren would've had Part 1 and Xu Huang 2.
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Shadowclaimer
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General who Pacifies the Fools
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:27 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
Very good point, It's the one for me I don't get either -_- . I really like Dun, but the only reason that was done was because it's the last stage for Wei, and they didn't want it ending with characters who're just about to get their highlights but haven't had a huge impact beforehand. Koei were just playing safe, that's all, but instead, playing safe has angered people. If there was another stage for Wei after Fan Castle, I have no doubt Cao Ren would've had Part 1 and Xu Huang 2.
Personally as much as I like the timeline versions of Kingdom Mode, I wish they would've legit ended Wei at Wu Zhang Plains. Would've made things a lot easier lol
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AdawgDaFAB
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Han's Unifier
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
It looks like if you die on a stage you lose whatever you earned in it. I was trying on a stage on a hard difficulty and died after killing the first general. When I checked afterwards I didn't have the 10 skill points I earned from that kill and my stats didn't update to show the kills I earned in the stage.
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The Outsider
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The Demon's Rival
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
I know, but to keep the historical factor, I think they're gonna kill Cao Pi off before Wu Zhang, and Cao Cao too, so they would've had to have made a whole new character to be present there. And with Sima Yi mving to Jin, you couldn't play him there for Wei either :( . I know these issues aren't unresolvable, but for Koei, it's a big deal :whistle: .
Edited by The Outsider, Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:33 pm.
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Yunchan
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Tiger General
[ *  *  *  * ]
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:29 pm
Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:27 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
Very good point, It's the one for me I don't get either -_- . I really like Dun, but the only reason that was done was because it's the last stage for Wei, and they didn't want it ending with characters who're just about to get their highlights but haven't had a huge impact beforehand. Koei were just playing safe, that's all, but instead, playing safe has angered people. If there was another stage for Wei after Fan Castle, I have no doubt Cao Ren would've had Part 1 and Xu Huang 2.
Personally as much as I like the timeline versions of Kingdom Mode, I wish they would've legit ended Wei at Wu Zhang Plains. Would've made things a lot easier lol
not really, neither Xiahou Dun nor Guan Yu could be at Wu Zhang
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Troy
Officer
[ *  * ]
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
I don't think they were going for historical accuracy. I think they care more about telling the stories they want to tell with the characters that they want to push forward. A lot of the complaints about Xiahou Dun are correct, but looking at it in another way, you'll see it makes complete sense from Koei's standpoint. The hardcore fans of the series, the people who will post about, talk about it, watch streams of it, don't make up a significant portion of the audience who will ultimately play the game. In fact I would wager that a large portion of those who play the game know very little about the novel let alone the actual history. These types of assumptions aren't crazy to make given the actual sales of games and the presence of message boards and websites.

Taking that into consideration, Xiahou Dun has always been a poster boy for Wei so to speak. He's always one of the first characters unlocked and that you play with. On top of that, they push him forward as one of their main characters (just look at the opening videos for example). When they decided to tell Wei's narrative, it both begins and ends with Xiahou Dun in terms of who you're playing with. Does it satisfy the hardcore fans? No, not really, but that probably doesn't matter to them as much as appealing to those who don't know as much about the history/novel as well as telling a narrative that can reasonably begin and end within the confines of Wei.

Now, along the way, they'll try to use as much of the novel/history as they can to keep hardcores satisfied with what's been presented to them, but overall that isn't their target audience.

I'm not suggesting I agree with the choices they made and am happy about all of their decisions, I merely accept the likely reasons behind them.
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NovemEnuma
Member Avatar
Officer
[ *  * ]
AdawgDaFAB
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:30 pm
It looks like if you die on a stage you lose whatever you earned in it. I was trying on a stage on a hard difficulty and died after killing the first general. When I checked afterwards I didn't have the 10 skill points I earned from that kill and my stats didn't update to show the kills I earned in the stage.
Question:

Do you earn more Kingdom Mode stages through playing Conquest Mode? (The Koei wikia page for DW7 says yes). However, I would like the true answer from someone who actually owns the game.
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The Outsider
Member Avatar
The Demon's Rival
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Yunchan
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:33 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:29 pm
Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:27 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
Very good point, It's the one for me I don't get either -_- . I really like Dun, but the only reason that was done was because it's the last stage for Wei, and they didn't want it ending with characters who're just about to get their highlights but haven't had a huge impact beforehand. Koei were just playing safe, that's all, but instead, playing safe has angered people. If there was another stage for Wei after Fan Castle, I have no doubt Cao Ren would've had Part 1 and Xu Huang 2.
Personally as much as I like the timeline versions of Kingdom Mode, I wish they would've legit ended Wei at Wu Zhang Plains. Would've made things a lot easier lol
not really, neither Xiahou Dun nor Guan Yu could be at Wu Zhang
I don't think anybody was saying they were :unsure: ?
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MĀJĒD
Commander
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
There's no Wu Zhang Plains?!
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Sheng Dao
Member Avatar
General
[ *  *  *  * ]
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:03 pm
As much as I hate the exclusion of some characters from Kingdom Mode, if you instantly hate the game and don't buy it because of that reason alone or downplay Koei as a whole because of it you're quite ignorant. Was it a stupid decision? Yes, it pretty much was, does it make Kingdom Mode absolute trash? Absolutely not, out of every single Dynasty Warriors game Kingdom Mode is by far the most in depth and cinematic Musou Mode we've ever had hands down, am I asking you to be thankful for it? Not directly, but please stop treating it like its something that shouldn't ever be played because your favorite characters got excluded.

Trust me, none of my mains made it in any of the Kingdom Modes, but I'm going to suck it up because Kingdom Mode itself is quite well put together (even with improper character choices), that and there's always Conquest Mode which is shaping up to be even better than I had previously thought, and you know characters like Zhou Tai, Taishi Ci, Lian Shi, Xu Huang, Cao Ren, and the others will be receiving 3 Legend Mode stages apiece (and given the quality of the ones we've seen so far, these should be quite amazing and better than what some Kingdom Mode Stages have offered anyway.
I agree 100% Some very questionable choices have been made for kingdom mode.
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Paragon of Light
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The Comeback King
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Well, it seems Wei's story ends before it becomes Wei. Hell, even Wu came into existence in their story.

And Xiahou Dun getting fancheng was not cool. He's a badass yes but that should of belonged to Cao Ren and Xu Huang.

Edit: At least Zhen is MENTIONED, which is more than I can say for the Qiaos.

Edited by Paragon of Light, Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:36 pm.
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Shadowclaimer
Member Avatar
General who Pacifies the Fools
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Yunchan
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:33 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:29 pm
Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:27 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
Very good point, It's the one for me I don't get either -_- . I really like Dun, but the only reason that was done was because it's the last stage for Wei, and they didn't want it ending with characters who're just about to get their highlights but haven't had a huge impact beforehand. Koei were just playing safe, that's all, but instead, playing safe has angered people. If there was another stage for Wei after Fan Castle, I have no doubt Cao Ren would've had Part 1 and Xu Huang 2.
Personally as much as I like the timeline versions of Kingdom Mode, I wish they would've legit ended Wei at Wu Zhang Plains. Would've made things a lot easier lol
not really, neither Xiahou Dun nor Guan Yu could be at Wu Zhang
I'm kinda aggravated that Xiahou Dun vs Guan Yu takes center stage of the whole conflict.. I miss the days when Cao Cao vs Liu Bei was the main point of contention.

And Troy I understand completely, I actually was going to post like a page and a half thing saying about the same thing but decided against it and closed after typing it since I figured it'd be too much. I just figured that they could've satisfied us both easily..
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Sheng Dao
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General
[ *  *  *  * ]
NovemEnuma
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:33 pm
AdawgDaFAB
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:30 pm
It looks like if you die on a stage you lose whatever you earned in it. I was trying on a stage on a hard difficulty and died after killing the first general. When I checked afterwards I didn't have the 10 skill points I earned from that kill and my stats didn't update to show the kills I earned in the stage.
Question:

Do you earn more Kingdom Mode stages through playing Conquest Mode? (The Koei wikia page for DW7 says yes). However, I would like the true answer from someone who actually owns the game.
Interesting, I'd like to know the answer to this as well.
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Liu Bei 7
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Emperor's Retainer
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majed12345
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:34 pm
There's no Wu Zhang Plains?!
Jin has Wu Zhang, not Wei.
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Sheng Dao
Member Avatar
General
[ *  *  *  * ]
Troy
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:33 pm
Shadowclaimer
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:24 pm
And as bothered as I am about the Kingdom Mode mishap with characters, its annoying to see people write it off so easily, but its also annoying to see people not care whatsoever. Koei was aiming for historical accuracy with this title, and a cinematic experience, they really really missed the mark on accuracy by ignoring some major achievements of characters.

Also its really easy to fit the entire roster of a faction into 25 missions at least once, there's plenty of slots for all of them. Xu Huang/Cao Ren should've gotten Fan Castle easily though, that's just.. that one makes no sense for them to neglect, it fits, it works, it wouldn't be a stretch, but instead they blew it off.

It just doesn't make sense, the story doesn't get advanced at all by throwing Xiahou Dun in there for both parts. You'd broaden Wei a lot more by implementing two of their major players.
I don't think they were going for historical accuracy. I think they care more about telling the stories they want to tell with the characters that they want to push forward. A lot of the complaints about Xiahou Dun are correct, but looking at it in another way, you'll see it makes complete sense from Koei's standpoint. The hardcore fans of the series, the people who will post about, talk about it, watch streams of it, don't make up a significant portion of the audience who will ultimately play the game. In fact I would wager that a large portion of those who play the game know very little about the novel let alone the actual history. These types of assumptions aren't crazy to make given the actual sales of games and the presence of message boards and websites.

Taking that into consideration, Xiahou Dun has always been a poster boy for Wei so to speak. He's always one of the first characters unlocked and that you play with. On top of that, they push him forward as one of their main characters (just look at the opening videos for example). When they decided to tell Wei's narrative, it both begins and ends with Xiahou Dun in terms of who you're playing with. Does it satisfy the hardcore fans? No, not really, but that probably doesn't matter to them as much as appealing to those who don't know as much about the history/novel as well as telling a narrative that can reasonably begin and end within the confines of Wei.

Now, along the way, they'll try to use as much of the novel/history as they can to keep hardcores satisfied with what's been presented to them, but overall that isn't their target audience.

I'm not suggesting I agree with the choices they made and am happy about all of their decisions, I merely accept the likely reasons behind them.
That makes alot of sense troy. You've probably nailed their reasoning dead on.
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The Outsider
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The Demon's Rival
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
majed12345
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:34 pm
There's no Wu Zhang Plains?!
For Wei no.

P.S. Exactly Troy :2up: .
Edited by The Outsider, Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:39 pm.
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MĀJĒD
Commander
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Jin start with Wu Zhang Plains !!

It's Sima Yi Isn't ?

Thats good we can say it's for Wei << kinda
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The Outsider
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The Demon's Rival
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majed12345
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:39 pm
Jin start with Wu Zhang Plains !!

It's Sima Yi Isn't ?

Thats good we can say it's for Wei << kinda
No, Wu Zhang isn't in Jins Kingdom Mode, but Sima Yi in Conquest Mode.
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Hero of Chaos
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魏王
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Wu Zhang Plains is most likely going to be Shu's last battle. It's neither in Wei's,nor in Jin's story mode. But Wei side is playable in Sima Yi's conquest mode stages.
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pariah.
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First Lieutenant
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Where the artworks
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Liu Bei 7
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Emperor's Retainer
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Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:41 pm
majed12345
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:39 pm
Jin start with Wu Zhang Plains !!

It's Sima Yi Isn't ?

Thats good we can say it's for Wei << kinda
No, Wu Zhang isn't in Jins Kingdom Mode, but Sima Yi in Conquest Mode.
I thought it was in their Kingdom Mode. If its only available in Conquest Mode for Wei, then I think its pretty clear Conquest Mode is the meat of this game.
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BuddHA0991
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Ace of Spades
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Liu Bei 7
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:44 pm
Tigris solis orientis
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:41 pm
majed12345
Wed Mar 9, 2011 8:39 pm
Jin start with Wu Zhang Plains !!

It's Sima Yi Isn't ?

Thats good we can say it's for Wei << kinda
No, Wu Zhang isn't in Jins Kingdom Mode, but Sima Yi in Conquest Mode.
I thought it was in their Kingdom Mode. If its only available in Conquest Mode for Wei, then I think its pretty clear Conquest Mode is the meat of this game.
but man, conquest mode stages are short and have no cutscenes, that sucks..
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Sagittarius
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私に触るな
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
AdawgDaFAB
Wed Mar 9, 2011 5:24 pm
I had to share these with everyone:
Alt Outfits pictures for the starting roster:
Spoiler: click to toggle


Black Hair, Han General Sun Jian = Favorite DW7 outfit I've seen so far!
And of course, they do whith Zhu Rong what I always hate; lighten her skin. That destroys her alternate colour for me. I really like Shang Xiang's though, much better than her default. Liu Bei, Sima Yi and Sun Jian's also look really good.
Thanks for posting that. ^_^

When you unlock Zhen Ji you totally have to upload a picture of her alternate. :XD
It looked like they got rid of her pants from what I saw of it in the stream.
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