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Three Kingdoms Q & A; Ask a question, get an answer
Topic Started: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:57 pm (23,863 Views)
SlickSlicer
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I'm not sure why there isn't a thread like this here, but I think it will help activity in this board if I make it. I ask that the mod of this forum sticky this topic along with my Sangoku Guideline.

The gist of this thread is that members can ask questions here about the historical Three Kingdoms period. I, or some other expert on this epoch in Chinese history can then answer your questions. Feel free to ask about anything from officer exploits to differences between the novel and history. :)
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Red Knight
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God of War
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I have a question. How did Cao Cao's father get adopted into the Cao clan and what's up with Cao Cao having two families on his father's side?
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Shogun
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mac lite
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Red Knight
Jul 17 2007, 10:16 AM
I have a question. How did Cao Cao's father get adopted into the Cao clan and what's up with Cao Cao having two families on his father's side?

Well, in the novel, it states that Cao Cao's father, Cao Song, was originally from the Xiahou family and was later adopted into the Cao family. A member in Koei's official site told me this, he's a fan of Cao Song.
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Wu Fei
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Jianghu Xiao
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Question- Was Gongsun Zan(公孫瓚) related or have any family connection other than being of the same surname to the Gongsun(s) of Liaodong and Xiangping? [Gongsun Du(公孫度), Gongsun Kang(公孫康), Gongsun Gong(公孫恭), and Gongsun Yuan(公孫淵).]

If they were infact related, I'm surprised that Gongsun Zan gave in to Yuan Shao and didn't even seek help or reinforcements from Gongsun Du when his forces were crumbling at the Battle of Yijing. Then again they might have bad blood, as in reference to Yuan Shao and Yuan Shu.
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Wenze
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As far as I know, they were not related, but the only reason I say that is because I have never read anywhere about them being related.
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SlickSlicer
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I'm fairly certain that they were completely different families. Gongsun wasn't that uncommon of a name, actually.
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Red Knight
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God of War
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Did Wang Yun play any role in Dong Zhuo's death historically? I think the novel says that he did but I'm not so sure.
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Little Conqueror of Jiang Dong
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江東之小霸王
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Yes, he did. His role is mentioned in Lu Bu's SGZ biography: he treated Lu Bu kindly from the start, and along with Shisun Rui, was plotting Dong Zhuo's murder. He let Lu Bu in on the plot, and Lu Bu was hesitant. Wang Yun convinced him, maintaining that Dong Zhuo was not Lu Bu's father, so Lu Bu consented to the plan. I'm assuming he was killed by Li Jue and Guo Si's troops when they retook the capital, but that part isn't mentioned.
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SlickSlicer
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I think he was too. In any case, his influence was ousted from the capital by those men and their retainers.

I'd like this topic to be stickied, please.
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Last_Stallion
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Special Task Force A-01
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What was Zhang Lu's five bushels sect about.
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DrewTheDude-Dono
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VAN DAMME KNOWS NO WEAKNESS!
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Zhang Lu held an area within China and was a strong religious leader.

After the death of his father, Zhang Heng, Zhang Lu inherited control of the Celestial Masters religious group, and therefore became its third leader. With this said, he then had some beef going on with Zhang Xiu{no family connection}. Eventually Liu Yan ordered Zhang Lu and Zhang Xiu to take out some dude named Su Gu. Zhang Lu had killed Zhang Xiu and absorbed his armies and eventually defeated Gu Su and had made his own territory. interestingly enough, he didn't mind taking orders from Liu Yan but didn't follow any the orders of Liu Zhang. Which is why a good deal of his family was executed.

What he did with his country was that he was said to have made it very humane and civilized. He had random stop bys that gave out free food and taxes were considered not for the ruler, but for the people themselves. He also had quite an military that was a match for Cao Cao's{around that time} and Li Jue's armies.

during Cao Cao's conquest, he decided to try and take Zhang Lu's territory. The problem was that Ma Chao and Han Sui were in his way. for those of you who played DW, I'm sure you would know that Ma Chao had gotten pwned in this battle and would go on to join Liu bei. I forget if there was a stage where Ma Chao was with Zhang Lu in DW, but historically he retreated int his territory{with Pang De} and had started hanging with him.

Ma Chao was actually suppose to marry Zhang Lu's daughter, but thanks to the suggestions of his advisor{forget his name} that didn't happen. Ma Chao would then take a bunch of troops to try and retake his territory but failed at that too. Which caused quite a bit of dislike between Zhang Lu and Ma Chao. Ma Chao joined Liu Bei after he surrounded Zhang Lu forces, but Pang De, however, had stayed with Zhang Lu.

Zhang Lu, knowing he would be screwed in a fight against Cao Cao, had figured surrendering the best plan. Though his younger brother, Zhang Wei I believed his name was, had decided to fight Cao Cao. Though he did fight Cao Cao, he just got pwned by him and was possibly killed by Xu Chu{also known as Xu Zhu in DW}. This led Zhang Lu to consider surrender even more now. Although Yang Bo{NOW I remember his name} had suggested that surrendering to early would leave him with no power. So they made up a plan where Zhang Lu retreated to his castle and left all of his gold behind saying that it wasn't his gold, but the gold of his people or something like that. Cao Cao was impressed with his personality and Zhang Lu had decided to surrender then afterwards. He had gained quite a bit of power under Cao Cao, but eventually the died the next year.

Just a random question, why do you think he went against Liu Zhang?
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Wenze
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This is the place to ask any question regarding the Three Kingdoms period that doesn't neccessarily require an entire topic for discussion. Feel free to ask any question on the era, and more than likely, one of the knowledgeable people on the era here will be able to help you. :)
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Astus
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I asked this before but never got a fulfilling answer and was hoping someone could answer it :)

Did Sha Moke actually serve the Nanman? And if he did, how long was it before he joined Shu?

Thanks to anyone who answers :)
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Wenze
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Omniscient Strategist
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In the novel, Sha Moke was the leader of the Nanman's before Meng Huo. In history, he was leader of the Miao Tribe, a Wuling based tribe that joined Liu Bei before Yiling.
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Astus
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Thanks a bundle for clearing it up ZhouTai50 :)

And in the novel/history, did Zhen Ji actually love Yuan Xi? And did she go willingly with Cao Pi?


EDIT: I just realised, a massive congratulations on becoming a mod ZhouTai50!!! :)
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Wenze
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Well, there isn't much about the relationship between Yuan Xi and Zhen Ji, what with Xi out on campaign with his father for long times. Though, there is the speculation that Cao Rui, Cao Pi's supposed son and heir, was actually Yuan Xi's child. But, again, given the amount of time Xi spent on campaign and the timeframe this would have to have been done in, I don't believe that.

EDIT: Well, when Cao Cao took over the city(Ye, I believe?) that Zhen Ji was in, Cao Pi made her his bride. I seriously doubt Zhen had any say in the matter. And, thank you, I'll do my best here as mod. :)
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Astus
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Cool, thanks again for answering!!

And the possibility of Cao Rui being Yuan Xi's son, albeit very unlikely is still very interesting.
So then the rest of the Cao legacy would be somewhat marred considering the 'noble line' of Yuan might have continued

And women back then were basically used as tools by the warlords so it isnt surprising i guess, they had to be totally submissive, it is quite sad but thus were the times, but anyway was there records of divorce in the Three Kingdom Period?
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Wenze
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The only instance of this I recall is when Cao Cao divorced his first wife, Lady Ding, due to her grief and anger over the death of Cao Ang, her son.
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Will
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God of Death in Gundam Wing
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is Wutugu real?
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Wenze
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Wu Tugu, like all the other Nanman's, save Meng Huo, is fictional. Luo Guanzhong justs adds his character in the novel to show Zhuge Liang's brilliance in contrast to Meng Huo's stubborness and lack of foresight.
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Astus
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ZhouTai50
Nov 29 2007, 02:50 AM
The only instance of this I recall is when Cao Cao divorced his first wife, Lady Ding, due to her grief and anger over the death of Cao Ang, her son.

How did Cao Ang die? And did Lady Ding ask for the divorce or was it forced upon her? And how many wives could a person have in the Three Kingdoms Era?

(Sorry for all the questions and thanks for having the patience to answer them =D)
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Wenze
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Cao Ang's historical death is the same as his novel death: Killed by Zhang Xiu's Forces after giving Cao Cao his horse so that he could escape.

I'm pretty sure that Cao Cao divorced her, after a failed attempt to reconcile with her.

Many in the Three Kingdoms Era(especially warlords) had more than one wife, and a number of concubines.
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Astus
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Thanks again ZhouTai50 :) , It's good to know that she let him have it.
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quocthai
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Prince of Jiang Dong.
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I got a question. Did Zhou Xun play any memorible role.
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Shogun
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mac lite
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There is already a Three Kingdoms Q + A thread.

Merged.
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