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| Question about the Mystics; Whose their leader? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sat Mar 24, 2012 6:23 pm (2,329 Views) | |
| ElizLestrad | Sat Mar 24, 2012 6:23 pm Post #1 |
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Elite Soldier
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I'm curious the Mystics were introduced in WO2, and at the time I couldnt figure out wether the leader was Taigong Wong or NuWa. Then in 3 they introduce Kaguya, who seemed an obvious choice for the leader of the Mystics, but in one of the conversations she states "I was sent" meaning someone told/ordered her to go and help. She also refers to Taigong Wong as "Master" but I dont know if shes using it as a sign of superior rank or as an honorific (San/Sama/etc). Its pretty obvious its not Ne Zah because the mystics state hes just a general, and its not Susanoo because he just killed Orochi but I dont recall them ever referring to him as a mystic himself. So I guess my question is, was Kaguya's line just a poor translation or is she in fact the leader of the Mystics? |
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| Komatsu | Sat Mar 24, 2012 7:30 pm Post #2 |
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(ʘ‿ʘ)✿ what'd you say about my Ina
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The leader of the Mystics is Susano'o. I am pretty sure that they actually state that, maybe even more than once, and it's on his official profile. Kaguya's not the leader by any stretch of the imagination. She uses -sama/lady/master to refer to everyone, even humans, so she's very polite. I think almost everyone in the Mystics outranks her, though. |
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| ElizLestrad | Sat Mar 24, 2012 10:28 pm Post #3 |
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Elite Soldier
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Hmm, thats disappointing. Kaguya seemed the obvious choice for their leader as Susanoo's conduct shows he has the pragmatic/inspirational abilities of a pet rock. I would say though that Taigong Wong's various conversations with/about her throughout the game (and as early as chapter 1) as he shows a great ammount of respect for her. The other two Mystics dont really have many conversations with her that I have caught so its hard to say how the other two feel about her (Mostly interested in Nu Wa's opinion as she was supposed to be powerful enough to seal Orochi herself) I would venture to guess from a hierarchal standpoint that she's the opposite of Ne Zah. Sort of like the Church had the Knights Templar and the Inquisition, Ne Zah is the military arm of the Mystics, and Kaguya the spiritual arm. Actually, from what I have noticed, NuWa looks down on both Taigong Wong (always calling him "boy") and is obnoxious with the other one. She even goes so far as to call Susanoo a stuborn idiot. So really, for her to be respectful to Kaguya when she isnt to anyone else does kinda say something... Edited by ElizLestrad, Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:37 am.
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| Tarrot | Sun Mar 25, 2012 6:58 am Post #4 |
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Soldier
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If Journey to the West is taken into account (which sets up an actual heirarchy among Chinese deities, of which Nu Wa, Fu Xi, and Taigong Wang would be a part of), the Budda is the highest ranking deity, and potentially the one in charge. |
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| Yoshinushi | Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:53 pm Post #5 |
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By Odin's Beard!
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Well the Buddha isn't in this game is he? Susanoo seems like kind of a weird choice for leader, seeing how he's kind of an asshole |
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| ElizLestrad | Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:04 pm Post #6 |
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Elite Soldier
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I came across the realization last night that NuWa might infact be above Taigong Wong. Wong makes a comment at one point on how NuWa was chosen to seal Orochi. Now given how powerful Orochi is made out to be it would seem odd for Susanoo to pick NuWa for the task if Taigong Wong was more powerful than her. Given that, I came up with an estimated hierarchy of the following: Leader: Susanoo Military: Ne Zah Spiritual: Kaguya Unknown: Nu Wa, Taigong Wong, Fu Xi On a side note what is up with the fishing rod? I've been wondering about that since O2... Edited by ElizLestrad, Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:07 pm.
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| Yoshinushi | Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:17 pm Post #7 |
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By Odin's Beard!
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I think the fishing rod thing stems from that when Taigong Wang was banished (Historically) he fished using a hookless rod, under the philosophy that the fish would come to him when they were ready. |
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| Mr. Kamikaze | Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:25 pm Post #8 |
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God of War
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Nuwa and Fu Xi are above Taigong Wang, in fact they imply that they are his mentors at some point in WO2. I believe. I don't think Susano'o is the leader of all the mystics...just of that particular...group. Or at least a high ranking general. Nuwa and Fu Xi clearly do not treat him as a leader at all, considering they pretty much told him he was all talk and laughed in his face...I don't think they'd be that nonchalant with their leader. But in terms of hierarchy, Susano'o, Fu Xi, and Nuwa certainly appear to be equals. With Kiyomori, Daji, Kaguya, and Taigong Wang somewhere under them. Himiko, Sun Wukong, Nezha, and Sanzang (though there is no context for her, at all, granted) seem to be below even them. So my understanding... Top: Susano'o, Fu Xi, Nuwa, Orochi (maybe) Middle: Kiyomori, Daji, Taigong Wang, Kaguya Bottom: Nezha, Himiko, Sun Wukong, Sanzang (?) Even Bottomer: Dodmeki, Gyuki Somewhere: Shuten Doji There is like zero context as to where Sanzang falls into place...but she more than likely just don't give a f*** ...she just wants to dance and junk. So, you go gurl. EDIT - Oh, and whoever is in fact the leader of the mystics...I assume Orochi is up there with them, if not on the same level as Nuwa, Susano'o, and Fu Xi Edited by Mr. Kamikaze, Sun Mar 25, 2012 4:27 pm.
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| Komatsu | Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:24 pm Post #9 |
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(ʘ‿ʘ)✿ what'd you say about my Ina
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Susano'o's conversations with Nuwa imply that they might have the same ranking or that he only slightly outranks her, but they're pretty bristly with one another, so it's hard to tell. He does tell her that he doesn't have to listen to her, so. |
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| Mysterious_Stranger | Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:26 pm Post #10 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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I was a little shocked when i saw NuWa mouth off to Susaon'o(sp?) since everyone else was all "hail the mighty king of the mystics!" whenever he showed up (he definetly has one of the best intros ever, i want my own chorus line whenever i show up ; __ ; Maybe the mystics just have a loose respect system or sumth'n? they certinly turn their noses up at humans pretty easily |
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| kingwutugu | Fri Mar 30, 2012 8:18 am Post #11 |
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Beast Master General
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Did you skip mystic heroes? wish one of those were a guest character(shiga), keeping them small though, not trying to make them too realistic. kinda how big the 1st date masamune was in SW1 |
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| Mr. Kamikaze | Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:44 pm Post #12 |
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God of War
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If I am not mistaken, both Taigong Wang and Da Ji appeared in Mystic Heroes. Obviously they were remodeled to fit the relatively more realistic style of DW/SW. |
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| PacMan76 | Tue Apr 3, 2012 12:35 am Post #13 |
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Forgotten Robot lacking AI, It's me PacMan.76! Waka Waka!
:D
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Taigong kinda didn't feel too much like a leader to me |
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| French Overlord | Tue Apr 3, 2012 4:02 am Post #14 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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is kaguya suppose to be susano wife or something? because when i |
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| kisura84 | Tue Apr 3, 2012 6:05 am Post #15 |
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Officer
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im curious about that too. you know, the mo2 scan's cover have kaguya and susanoo's weapons together. and the conversation between them kind of suggest romatic feeling. someone please clarify this, its so confusing. (in myth susanoo has a wife so...) |
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| Mr. Kamikaze | Wed Apr 4, 2012 5:25 am Post #16 |
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God of War
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I don't think it's romantic, Kaguya is just a very nurturing person, and Susano'o is brash and pretty cold to everyone. She's probably just trying to get under his very thick skin. |
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| French Overlord | Wed Apr 4, 2012 5:35 am Post #17 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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go in your gallery and listen to all of kaguya discussion... it's far from being just nurturing lol here's the first conversation: Kagu: That was a violent battle, Lord Sasano's. Are...are you okay? Susy: You don't need to cozy up to me. Go share that kindness whit someone else Kagu: Lord Susano's, please... please accept my love... yeah .______. are there any myth or legend saying something about that? Edited by French Overlord, Wed Apr 4, 2012 5:41 am.
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| Komatsu | Wed Apr 4, 2012 6:03 am Post #18 |
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(ʘ‿ʘ)✿ what'd you say about my Ina
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There are all kinds of love aside from romantic love. ![]() But no, Kaguya and Susano'o aren't related in myths at all. His wife is Kushinada-hime, and Kaguya is the princess of the moon, not to mention his story is somewhat of a creationist story and hers is set in the Heian era. Most of the mystics are very affectionate to her, it's not just him. |
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| Lord_Redhand | Wed Apr 4, 2012 6:46 am Post #19 |
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General
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I'd say throw in a curve ball for the Mystuc forces in the next game and add in Apollo (We have the Moon so why not The Sun?) As to leader.. militarily it's Susano'o for this game. |
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| Komatsu | Wed Apr 4, 2012 6:56 am Post #20 |
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(ʘ‿ʘ)✿ what'd you say about my Ina
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Well, Japan has Amaterasu as their Sun Goddess, so if they were going to add in a Sun mystic, it would probably be her, since all the Mystics so far are either Japanese or Chinese... |
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| Lord_Redhand | Wed Apr 4, 2012 7:50 am Post #21 |
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General
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Mostly kidding... mostly... It's more of the dream of being able to play as characters referenced in Achilles quotes getting to me. |
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| pupi | Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:20 am Post #22 |
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Soldier
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Sanzang is actually Wukong's master. She's kind of mysterious as a character, she has a conversation in the camp with Kai (I believe.) Kai asks her if she can see Sanzang's hands, and Sanzang says she doesn't show her hands unless she must do so, implying that she is limiting her full power by using sleeves as weapons. So even though she is a very minor character, I think she is actually more powerful than she looks. Edited by pupi, Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:21 am.
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| PGres582 | Mon Apr 23, 2012 5:10 am Post #23 |
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「Radiance」
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It was Okuni who wanted to see Sanzang's hands. I honestly believe she falls outside the hierarchy of the Mystics. She has no real interaction with the other Mystics besides Wukong as her disciple, and the only reason she fights Kiyomori is because Wukong has a debt to pay to him, so she wants to eliminate him to retrieve her partner. |
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| Komatsu | Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:51 am Post #24 |
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(ʘ‿ʘ)✿ what'd you say about my Ina
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Sanzang mentions Journey to the West in the game (she remembers traveling with Wukong and the others) so it's possible that while she's a Mystic, she's just a priestess and doesn't have any ranking, while the others definitely have military positions. |
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| Joetri10 | Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:33 am Post #25 |
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Don't Even Pray For Me, No!
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From what i gathered... Susano is the leader of the Mystic Army (In terms of Military Rank) Fu Xi and Nu Wa are almost on the same level as him and have been placed below him although I don’t think they care. Taigong Wang is simply one of the Mystics top strategists and also very powerful and trusted to do any tasks given although Nu Wa and Fu Xi feel the need to look out for him. Kaguya i think does not have a title despite her power but is most likely well known throughout the mystic Realm. Nezha was one of the Mystics Top Generals and favoured by Susano. Sun Wukong is simply someone very strong who was causing trouble on his adventures and now feels indebted to Kiyomori, whether he is stronger or weaker than any of the other mystics is up in the air i think, I’m not sure. Sanzang WuKongs Master. As for the Orochi side of things... I feel Orochi was on par with Susano in terms of power yet was a criminal and thus Susano and his two main generals imprisoned him. Da Ji and Kiyomori Serve Orochi through their own personal reason, although i think Da Ji is actually very limited in her power. Shuten Doji is just orochi (Is he not :S ) Edited by Joetri10, Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:47 pm.
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