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| Samurai Warriors: Spirit of Sanada; New Characters: Sanada Masayuki, Chacha, Sasuke, Lady Muramatsu, Takeda Katsuyori, Tokugawa Hidetada | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:15 pm (168,779 Views) | |
| symph | Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:35 am Post #2951 |
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First Lieutenant
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Just finished this game a couple of days ago. Waited a long time to actually play it. Bought it at release but still had to finish making my way through the banal Samurai Warriors 4-II which was so bad storywise at some points that I actually stopped playing it for over a year. The only Warriors game bad enough to make me stop playing up to that point was Dynasty Warriors 6 because of the bad gameplay. I thought 4-II's super genero anime story writing was bad. I finally got some time to clear out some of my extensive back catalog and was hoping that SoS would ash the bad taste of 4-II out of my mouth. I mean, Yukimura has a BEARD on the cover! This game has to be more grounded and old school storywise, right? Well, I should have looked at the abbreviation closer. SoS. This game needs help. Worst story of any Warriors game I've ever played. Worst CHARACTER in Koei history. CHACHA is the worst thing to happen in any Koei or Warriors game. Heck, probably one of the worst characters in video game history. Just garbage. This game and effing Sengoku Basara Sanada Yukimura Den. I thought it was weird that both Capcom and Koei decide to do the same gimmick and then both decide we want to play as babies as well. Apparently we also wanted more dumb gimmicks and fail states in games too rather than fun improvements. The gameplay of SoS actually isn't that bad though I can't stand what Hyper attacks have done to the Samurai Warriors gameplay. The gameplay that used to be the deeper incarnation of Warriors gameplay compared to Dynasty Warriors. These guys can't write. I wonder if all the good writers and story designers were put on other project because lately these guys can't write. It's so bad and even more tragic when you look at games like Samurai Warriors 2. Heck, even Samurai Warriors terrible Wii gameplay 3 had amazing writing. Heck, even 4, with it's new super genero anime bend with kawaiil0lwaifusan Naotora and Silver Haired Andy Bog... I mean Nobuyuki and mega anime know-it-all Takatora Todo had good writing until 4-II crapped all over it with it's bad characterizations and inhuman, nonsensical conversation graduations. And we can't forget THE GIRLS d00d! Waifusans! This franchise's recent bend toward trying to DOA all their females and the franchise itself is one of the worst things to happen. Way too much focus on random girls that did nothing. Hideyori is nowhere to be seen in SoS but I can watch CHACHA all day with hair blond as the sun as yellow (we get it, Japan, you want to kiss blonde white girls) get involved in everything and be one of those annoying, irredeemable anime girls that is obnoxious and agitating but everyone puts up with it, sometimes even obliviously, because I guess people are supposed to want to kiss her by default or something. Quick tip: Trying to do a "woe is her she's seen death" storyline DURING THE WARRING STATES PERIOD is STUPID. Death and destruction are happening everywhere. Japan is in turmoil. Warlords are changing the face of the country left and right. And I'm supposed to feel sorry for effing CHACHA who didn't even fight people? Oh, don't get me started on CHACHA's role in battles making a joke out of the entire game. "INA! WHY DO YOU FIGHT!" says Tadakatsu Honda in Ina's first cutscene in Samurai Warriors 1. This is war! This crap means something! And Ina had a purpose! She was a combatant and you were given the impression that she had been prepared for that moment. The nation of war was respected in Samurai Warriors 1 Xtreme Legends. Then we get to SoS. "Let's all fight the Chosoka.... Who dat on da battlefield! is dat CHACHA! She lookin for her friend! She not supposed to be out there! Someone go get her! Protect CHACHA! She is my entire world!" *CHACHA has defeated 400 enemies.* CHACHA: (insert dumb@$$ brooding comment from genero blonde, non-threatening character that makes the game look like a joke and the battles look like they have no stakes or meaning). EVERYTHING reovlving around CHACHA. Yukimura's story, drive and purpose all wrap up to be about protecting CHACHA! Dumb. Ruined character. And don't even get me started on Grassy@$$. I knew once the babies started talking like they were 56 years old and I saw a big headed baby Chacha swat away a grown man's hand while mean mugging that effing Grassy@$$ was about to get promoted in the grand scheme of things. Purple-haired, pig-tailed girl with dumb anime catchphrases wearing gothic lolita clothes is simply too much for them to resist. Terrible character and one of the worst things Koei has going on right now. Collecting all the girls in SW4-II for them to put on a dancing concert was the lowest point of ANY Warriors franchise. ANY. And that's including the terrible plot evolution of Warriors Orochi 3 and all it's updates. Oh, and then CHACHA busts out a weird, inhuman looking smile toward the end and that's supposed to be the big payoff and corner turn. Dumb crap. Nice that they relegated that major moment (...) to one of their awkward visual novel style "characters stand and do limited, unnatural motions" cutscenes they've been using with the same music and motif for over three years. What happened? I could go on for hours about the terrible writing, the terrible characterizations and the terrible CHACHA. Masayuki was extremely obnoxious until he got older and the only thing that changed when he got older was that people actually started to notice and act like he was obnoxious and insufferable which was at least cool. Starting with 4-II it seems they have forgotten how to make a compelling, likeable character. All they seem to know how to do is make them extremely omniscient know-it-alls who did it all which makes the world seems smaller and other cast members far less significant. These guys can't keep ANYTHING a secret or let it build organically. You can't get to any major event without one of the new characters looking off to the side, crossing their arms and telling you exactly what the F is going to happen. Takatora Todo: "Well, Nagamasa, I just hope you're right. But I feel that one day tragedy may befall you. And while your wife might live she might end up dying anyway, probably after she's married to one of Nobunaga's generals. Probably some time after Nobunaga himself is suddenly slain in an act of deserved treachery. And after power is consolidated once more it will be broken once again when whoever did it leaves behind a young heir too young to govern which may lead to a divide in Japan in which all its great warriors will choose a side at some place like Sekigahara where a bunch of people will have to fight someone important to them because we recycled that storyline 837403857 times in SW4-II rather than have it be unique to the main character like it should have been." But don't worry, you will probably be able to find lots of DLC outfits for the girls! That's what it's all about, right? You play this game to love and kiss the girls and have waifus! Not to enjoy a game about the chaotic Sengoku era and how mighty heroes all played a role in shaping those tumultuous times. Where, no matter how impressive, the land seemed to sometimes have a will of its own and everyone was one piece of a much bigger puzzle. They effing retconned Hideyori so that they didn't have to address one of the most compelling aspects of CHACHA's life, being the concubine of Hideyoshi. I have to play effing Nioh to see a good CHACHA? What the F? Terrible character. And just beat the entire story's @$$ with the dumb retcon and her being positioned as the kinda love interest for Yukimura who's just infaturated with CHACHA and only CHACHA for reasons that never materialize outside of CHACHA. On top of all this it seems like every new in-battle feature they added is some dumb@$$ restriction or new way to lose. "Don't let the enemy touch this part of the map or it's all over even though in the next battle they've just been in there anyways. How about some stealth!!!! Yeah! That'll transfer well into this game!" It didn't, by the way. The whole RPG/exploration elements of the game never came together. They didn't feel cohesive at all. It all felt stapled on. The battles, the exploration and the story never melded together. It was just awnward and stapled on like a lot of these modes are. The difference being that, in Dynasty Warriors 8 for example, it wasn't the core of the game. You didn't throw a bunch of rare materials into Sakon's weapon and then have him disappear. Bad design. You can't have exploration and RPG like gameplay with forging and materials and collecting and investing in things when the player can't properly predict who the F they are even going to be able to play in the next battle (hint: probably CHACHA). Thank goodness for Hidetada who singlehanded kept the game from being a straight zero. F this game. F grassy@$$ being injected into everything. F no Hideyori. F the new anime waifusan bend to the once glorious SW franchise. F the bad writing. F the inhuman characters. F the nonsensical conversation progressions. F the non-cohesive gameplay elements. and most importantly... F CHACHA. |
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| AntonKutovoi | Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:25 am Post #2952 |
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Legend
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Wow, now that's an intelligent post "Anime game is anime!" "Who let girls on the battlefield?! It breaks all immersion!" "Oh, no blonde girl! I want to kiss her (seriously, how many times did you say that?), but I can't so I going to hate her so much"
Edited by AntonKutovoi, Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:25 am.
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| Maya | Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:50 am Post #2953 |
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General
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There is something I absolutely agree with though: 1. Removing the only interesting aspects of Chacha was boring. 2. Tying Chacha to the Sanada is boring as well since Chacha certainly did not care about the Sanada (where was Chacha when the Sanada went to exile if she was 'so close to them'). Chacha is better off without the Sanada except for brief interaction during Osaka along with Hideyori. Yukimura was not even a servant that died alongside Chacha the one who died with Chacha and Hideyori was his oldest son who some people are said to have even urged to flee due to his young age. Nioh's Chacha had a meh storyline as well however at least a good design. The only decent Chacha recently is Nobunaga's Ambition Chacha. I still hope that Chacha gets a entire new story next time. Edited by Maya, Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:50 am.
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| AntonKutovoi | Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:08 am Post #2954 |
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Legend
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I don’t mind Chacha’s interactions with Yukimura, it featured quite often popular culture, so I don’t think it’s out of place. What Chacha actually needs is more interactions with Hideyoshi and Mitsunari. Perhaps Hideyori as well, but he will be a little hard to add now.
Edited by AntonKutovoi, Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:11 am.
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| Kuroda Kanbei | Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:48 am Post #2955 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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While Symps post was a bit to strongly worded and angrish I do agree that there's a bit to much anime coming into the story. To an extend anime influences have always been in Samurai Warriors but we never saw Nobunaga's personality altered in the past just to pursue a shonen trend of wanting to be ''surpassed'' The story hasn't benefited from this and it should be toned down when its time for SW5 Edited by Kuroda Kanbei, Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:49 am.
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| LordTerrantos | Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:55 am Post #2956 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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I really don't see why people think Chacha needs to be historically correct. Yes in history Chacha only interacted with Yukimura at Osaka, and even offered him a large amount of Koku if they somehow won against the tokugawa. but i think some people forget alot of the SW versions are nothing like the versions in History. Chacha included. Like i really doubt Chacha distant herself from the Azai retainers just so rumors of a rebellion wouldn't spread. or actually cared about the Toyotomi and Hideyoshi or tried to prevent a war between Mitsunari and Ieyasu. Do i think her interactions with Yukimura are bad? Absolutely not. I don't think thier out of place like Maya seems to believe. and with what characters they had and being a Sanada focused game, i think it did help develop both Chacha and Yukimura in some way no matter how small. Now with Nioh yes maybe they could of done something better with Chacha instead of just making her like the SW one where her only friend is Yukimura. and sure while Chacha being the concubine of Hideyoshi and the mother of Hideyori is one of the more interesting prospects of her character. I seen plenty of series where Chacha does not need to be this. Like there is plenty of things they could do to work around this, like make Chacha Hideyori's Adopted Mother. Like if they use the anime Hideyori as a basis for the game Hideyori (if he is added). Hideyori would still resemble Nene, so Nene would probably be his Mother in game. even if she wasn't in history. That said i kinda Doubt Hideyori will be included at this point and stage. He would be kinda pointless and what would he offer anyway? other then him being the final foe for Ieyasu and being Chacha's Son (or adopted depending on what they do). He only would have one battle and stage. they be better off adding someone more worth adding like Matabei Goto or Nagamasa Kuroda. But Samurai Warriors to me seems to be loosely based on History it follows historical events but not everything will be accurate. such as how Hisahide fake his death in SW4-2. And while i Do LOVE the anime influence the series has, i do think they can tone it down even if only a little. because its coming off as too much shonen and less warriors like. and i think SW5 could do what DW9 is doing with the designs. and give the SW characters more Warriors-looking designs but combines it with anime and realistic influence. Edited by LordTerrantos, Wed Jan 24, 2018 4:12 am.
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| AntonKutovoi | Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:53 am Post #2957 |
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Legend
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Here’s a thing though- it’s not about anime, but about what direction character goes. For Nobunaga they simply changed his entire motivation for some reason. SW3 Nobunaga is still the best one, despite being an anime character as well. |
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| Maya | Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:19 am Post #2958 |
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General
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The interactions are bad to me since they try to eliminate HideyoshixChacha in most games now for a crack pairing despite Chacha historically doing pretty much nothing for the Sanada with the exception of being Hideyori's mother and the actual boss of the Sanada was also Hideyori (thus he would have rewarded the Sanada if anyone). If you eliminate all the Toyotomi/actual connections of Chacha (Hideyoshi, Nene, Mitsunari or in case of Nobunaga's Ambition Harunaga) she becomes just a random Toyotomi officer. Why is she in Osaka? What does Ieyasu have against her at all? Etc. Even with removing Hideyori her being Hideyoshi's concubine is crucial since they could at least depict her as an ambituous wife. Than I don't see why she was added at all if they are just into trying to have her interact with Yukimura. Than they could have just added Akihime which would have made more sense anyway seeing this was a Sanada game and since Yoshitsugu is longer around than Oichi/Nagamasa/Katsuie (leading to Chacha and perhaps Hideyori as NPC in Osaka leading to Chacha playable in SW5). Than they could have also randomly even picked a defender instead of Chacha as well. Edited by Maya, Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:33 am.
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| Fūma | Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:13 am Post #2959 |
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The Dragon Has Returned
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SW1's Nobunaga is the best. I don't really like his portrayal in the later games, he feels like a villain in those. He tends to act sort of weird especially in SW4. |
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| AntonKutovoi | Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:26 am Post #2960 |
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Legend
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I found him to be a villain in SW1 and SW4, in SW3 (especially in Chronicles) he was more of a dark hero and a man of vision. In SW2 he was neither. Just an ambitious man. |
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| LordTerrantos | Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:26 pm Post #2961 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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Again i think your a bit too obsessed with the historical side of things here. Yes i think Chacha does need her interactions with Mitsunari, Hideyoshi, and Nene. but frankly they are also never going to remove Nene thus chances of Chacha acting as a Wife of Hideyoshi are out the Window. there probably would of been a chance of that if Nene died sometime when Hideyoshi is alive but she doesn't. Espeically when Kai another concubine of Hideyoshi doesn't even be acknowledged as his concubine either. yes we do need Chacha to have some interactions with the Toyotomi for a better explanation on why she is at Osaka, what Ieyasu has a against her. But as i said Chacha does not necessarily need to be Hideyoshi's concubine to stand out as both a character or be Hideyori's Biological Mother. Hidetada took some influence of his anime counterpart's design. and frankly i think Hideyori is likely to get the same thing if he gets added, and given his appearance in the anime. he resembles Nene and Hideyoshi more then he would Chacha. So Chacha be better being his Adopted Mother in the Samurai Warriors Universe. She doesn't need to be Hideyoshi's Wife to be ambitious either. I am well aware how much her being Hideyoshi's concubine is important, but the reality is. Omega Force is against using the concept and term of Concubine. which is why even Koshosho and Kai are never acknowledged as this as well. and Akihime should of been in the game as well, probably over Muramatsu more then Chacha if you ask me. because at Least Akihime would have a actual role and purpose. while Muramatsu doesn't. and while i agree Chacha probably should of been saved for SW5, we got her in SoS. even with her problems as a character i do think they can fix these in SW5, i just would not expect any concubine status in SW5, but interactions with the toyotomi is far more likely. and again Akihime does have plenty of connections to make her work for the story too specifically with her connections with the Toyotomi and the Sanada. If it was up to me. I would of added Chacha, Akihime, and One of the Defenders of Osaka in all honesty. Edited by LordTerrantos, Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:30 pm.
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| Fūma | Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:35 pm Post #2962 |
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The Dragon Has Returned
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Sorry I meant to say he feels less like a villain in the later games. He feels like the main antagonist guy in SW1, whereas in subsequent games he's more like an important ambitious man who dies halfway through the story. |
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| AntonKutovoi | Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:23 pm Post #2963 |
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Legend
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Well, in that case I'll say that he shouldn't be portrayed as a villian. Dark hero is the best choice for him. |
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| symph | Tue Feb 6, 2018 7:43 pm Post #2964 |
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First Lieutenant
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Sorry, but this post contains a lot of nonsense. This is why so many games are losing a lot of their bite and edge. People campaign for the destruction of any grounding. Of any rules. Too obsessed with history to not have the devs SCRAP the existence of a critical figure in order to replace him with some new white girl they want you to fawn over? Speaking of which, where's the super deep, dread-locked African looking "Japanese" girl in these games? But seriously, these games were built on their historical groundings. That's what governs all interest. To see how they will best interpret history with the resources they have. To see legendary events portrayed by stylized but grounded characters. To see not as legendary but still significant events come to life. That's the part that adds the second level appeal to these games (the gameplay being the base level). It's the reason we can see the Yellow Turban Rebellion reinterpreted over and over again in Dynasty Warriors. There's always some different element to capture. Once you take that away and start arguing for the elevation of liberties over some sort of grounded historical context you're not playing JUST ANOTHER BORING@$$ ANIME GAME. I can feel the longing of this franchise to be Sengoku Basara and that sucks. Sengoku Basara takes all the liberties and is far less grounded and that's what gives it it's appeal. It's dumb for SW to try to become a poor mans copy by shoehorning in a bunch of its gimmick without same level of finesse. Unless we are talking about that trash known as Sanada Yukimura Den. These games need to can the gimmicks, get over themselves, stick to what makes them unique and actually good and stop trying to become interactive versions of some kind of banal crunchyroll fodder. You can't just staple "ideas" onto a game and call it good. The ideas have to be well implemented and fleshed out. Koei used to be good at taking liberties. Take a character like Oichi or Okuni and give them a suitable, fitting roll with the right contexts and you can create an amazing character (Okuni in particular). Over-expose them or heavy-handedly shove them down people's throats and kill the bite of significant events by shoehorning them into them while making all the characters SOUND STUPID while talking about them and you have makings of one of the worst video game characters I've had the displeasure of witnessing. Cha Cha is everything wrong with video game characters today. Gracia is getting up there even though she was perfectly fine in SW2XL because she was booked correctly and was givien a fitting role (they were even smart enough to keep her off the same screen as Mitsuhide since he doesn't look old enough to have a kid that old. BUt now they just say F it and have Naomasa look twice the age of his mother). Spirit of Sanada and SW4-II need to be forgotten. |
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| LordTerrantos | Tue Feb 6, 2018 8:19 pm Post #2965 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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I never said that the games shouldn't follow history, as i love japanese history. and Chinese history both. of course there going to follow history. But look at some things about the games that aren't exactly historically accurate here. Hayakawa being a Strategist, Mitsunari's friendship with Kanetsugu/Yukimura, or even his friendship with Masanori/Kiyomasa. even some of the battles aren't 100% accurate either. Yes i understand how these events, battles, or how the characters portrayal being a major interest by many people. As i too take a interest in it, hell while i like Chacha i am disappointed they didn't really add any of her manipulative or evil side she is known for in many stories. but the fact is i really do not see the whole concubine thing ever being part of SW, the same way omega force seems to not want to include religion or incest. which is why Kiyomasa is permanently stuck as what he is right now. unlike how he was in history as a Brutal and cold man who ordered christian hunts and even killed christian women who were pregnant. Chacha has problems yes, but i do not think she represents "everything that is wrong with game characters today". Gracia has ALOT of issues and really i do think she does need fixing, they can keep the gothic loli for all i care because frankly that is why she is popular in japan right now and i don't see that ever changing at this point. they just really need to make Gracia have a significant role in the series, even if they have to add her husband to do so. and i am sorry to say but the DW and SW series always had some anime level of influence in them even back during SW1 and DW2. were they as anime-level as they are in DW8 and SW4. probably not but its still there, anime is as much part of thier culture as thier history whether we like it or not. and DW9 is really trying to appeal to both sides: as the designs of the characters take aspects of realism and anime into the characters. we can only hope SW5 will do something similar and give characters like Chacha or Toshiie. a design that takes aspects of realism and anime into it. and yes i agree each battle in each installment does add a different element but there is also alot of fictional stuff in these games too. whether its a fictional character or even a fictional friendship such as the likes of Yoshitsugu and Takatora. I am not saying people should not want to see the historical sides of things, as thats what the game is based upon. but i afraid the more interesting aspects of Chacha, namely her concubine status will never be spoken about. because Omega force does not seem to want to mention Christianity, Incest, or the whole concubine issue. so they are likely going have to find a way to work around that to make Chacha work. and have her interact more with Mitsunari, Hideyoshi, Nene, and other toyotomi characters. |
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| Katsuie's Disciple | Tue Feb 6, 2018 8:23 pm Post #2966 |
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Backbone of the Toyotomi
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I agree with you on almost all your points, SW2 was the absolute pinnacle of the Warriors series, simply flawless. Chacha is extremely grating and gets roles she does not deserve in the story, Gracia should be burned in a building just like history, her role is absolutely ridiculous, she did not deserve to survive and contributed to nothing but pointless exposition. I am glad that they dialled heavily back on Koshosho though, she annoyed me so much in 4 where she was bloody everywhere and effectively took over roles Okuni could have easily fulfilled as well as outlasting virtually every other character. The Shibata need to have their perspective of Shizugatake restored (i think it was in Chronicles 3 as DLC) and storytelling needs to go back to basics. Most other characters in SW i do find heavily interesting or at least one portrayal of them throughout the story, including Masayuki who i do like, he's not a perfect protagonist, he's prone to failure and despite being a smart man, is also not above deceit and pragmatic morality to ensure his family's survival. Yukimura (when not with Chacha) also felt greatly improved in the game, he was no longer a Mary Sue but had to learn from Masayuki, slowly getting his intellectual side to match his passion for battle. But the other problem is, i feel like too many characters are shafted off to the side or interchangeable. If No, Yoshimoto Imagawa, Kojiro Sasaki or Muneshige Tachibana disappeared, would anyone notice? I certainly wouldn't since Koei treats them like utter garbage for the same annoying faces. I also hope that the Western Army bias in the stories stop, and wish for the return of hypotheticals. Want to see Masamune not just be a Tokugawa lapdog again, or the situation surrounding Kanbei Kuroda at Sekigahara be explored with more depth, i do hope individual stories return in SW5, there is a lot more interest throughout the era than DW (early era always gets more than late) but SW can diversify it with different starting points, they just need to look at SW2 and improve it from there as well as modernise the gameplay (more of a challenge than just redzone please). I also think that the linear gameplay and closed gates have got to go, SW4 and SOS felt more like a checklist or job than actually enjoying the game, i want more free-flowing missions such as the first two games and a morale system back, the strategems were a good addition but i think they should be earned via quests and such (especially if SW5 turns out like DW9). But that's my rant done for today. |
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| Kuroda Kanbei | Tue Feb 6, 2018 11:49 pm Post #2967 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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I think that Noh aside its just really hard to work with characters like this because they tend to fall outside the story to a large extend. Its Yoshimoto's death that starts the main story, The Edo swordsmen only become important lang after the Sengoku period and with Kyushu having so little relevance Muneshige's story really only starts at the very end of the Toyotomi story which leaves only the overly crowded Odawara and Sekigahara arcs for him to do anything in. They could force more Tachibana presence by just making him fight the Shimazu and generics over and over again but that would get really dull. Its not that Koei treats them like garbage per se but aside from Noh they really don't much much of a place in the story.
I'd say the western army bias has long since stopped. Ieyasu has been an incredibly benevolent lord for a long time now and later installments have increasingly robbed Mitsunari of some of his points that could once have been valid. Ieyasu becoming more noble robs Mitsunari of his moral highground and Hideyoshi openly naming Ieyasu his successor robs him of his legitimacy for his cause. As for Kanbei, I'm pleasantly surprised his little arc gets time devoted to it at all when you consider he's somewhat of a side character(though probably the most important of the side characters) and his battle seems to be the least significant, smallest scale and most obscure of all the Sekigahara battles. And yet its been included in every game Kanbei has been in. Edited by Kuroda Kanbei, Tue Feb 6, 2018 11:52 pm.
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| Katsuie's Disciple | Wed Feb 7, 2018 6:53 pm Post #2968 |
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Backbone of the Toyotomi
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Yeah i agree with that, Muneshige is bland and boring, he kinda is a detriment to Ginchiyo if you ask me, Koei can't even be bothered to show his historical battles either (Otsu Castle). Noh is just Nobunaga's eye candy at this point (no hypotheticals=no psychopath), Kojiro and Musashi, no matter how perfect they were during their debut, Koei gives them the vaguest relations in story and never follows up (why was Musashi part of the Kuroda in 4 exactly?) and Yoshimoto should be more relevant, with an earlier starting date like 3 making it entirely possible. Nevertheless i do hope hypotheticals soon. And the second point i do agree on, yet all the stories and characters who get the most screen time are from the Western Army unfortuantely. I do think that Ieyasu is a much better man than the cold, uncaring Mitsunari who gets a flock of undeserved sympathy but in terms of actual screentime, the West always get more than the East for whatever ungodly reason, the Tokugawa only got one or two renditions of their famous exploits while the Western/Toyotomi forces often have a lot more, thus making them more "heroic." |
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| vivi | Wed Feb 7, 2018 9:40 pm Post #2969 |
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Bot
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I actually really liked Chacha being a proxy for Hideyori. It made the story more interesting for me even if it's not historically accurate (but no musou game iz.) I also REALLY hated Sasuke at first but I found myself genuinely sad over his arc at the end of the game. I think I ended up growing attached to everyone from the main four (Yuki, Kumoichi, Sasuke, and Chacha) by the end. I don't understand the disdain for Gracia either, her personality is fine imo and I find her relationship to Chacha and Koshosho sweet. It would have more emotional impact if she died at Osaka though |
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| SRS | Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:27 am Post #2970 |
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Master of the War Trident
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Finally have the game myself. Up to Nagashino so far, everything's about what I expected. For some reason I'm really enjoying using Kunoichi now. It's funny cuz I used to hate her in SW1 and only tolerated her in SW3. Edit: Finished Nagashino. That's the first time I actually felt sad seeing all of the Takeda retainers dying, with Katsuyori and Masayuki's reactions on top of it. Edited by SRS, Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:01 pm.
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| Tai Sei | Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:05 am Post #2971 |
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Sergeant
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i managed to beat this game last night and i honestly enjoyed myself quite alot, i knew how the ending would play out but i still felt kinda sad about it, if anything this game made me think of yukimura as more then some boring anime hothead, maybe still not the most interesting guy, but i liked how they showed his intelligence off more in this entry. also holy crap i was feeling bad whenever the game would just be like "hey look at all these UNPC's die in battle" more so when you spend the majority of the game with them. |
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| symph | Fri Mar 2, 2018 4:20 am Post #2972 |
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First Lieutenant
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I've ranted enough and I am glad people here took time to actually read what I was saying rather than reflexively respond and defend. I could continue with a lot more things that bothered me but currently I'm both happy with how DW9 turned out (though it's not perfect it's still REALLY good, way better than it should be and Koei should be heavily shamed for both the bad launch state of the game and the fact that they completely mislead you into thinking the game will be a boring step-and-fetchit run through a boring, ugly world at the beginning) and I also don't want to rain on the parade of those who've recently chimed in about their recent enjoyment of the game. I don't want to dissuade any of the people who've come in to say they are liking it. Some things just aren't my style. I do think that it's possible for the games to go back to having a broader appeal with a little less leaning on the anime tropes. |
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| LordTerrantos | Sat Mar 3, 2018 10:36 am Post #2973 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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this is a very old and outdated question. but do we know the reason for why the Taiga Drama DLC was not on the western version? like the sanada horse, or Tadakatsu's taiga drama armor, and etc. |
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| AntonKutovoi | Sat Mar 3, 2018 10:50 am Post #2974 |
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Legend
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Licensing problems, I guess. |
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| Motrini | Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:14 pm Post #2975 |
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Right General
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I've finished the game a few months ago. I thought the first half of the story worked quite well and had the right balance of history and fiction for a Musou title (definitely miles better than SW4-II). Masayuki might not be the deepest character ever appeared in a videogame, but he has a believable personality alongside motivations you can relate with, which is a huge improvement over the ridicously idelialized and monodimensional characters we usually get. This also makes the story a whole lot better since it allows it to flow naturally without the game shoving long dialogues devoid of any actual substance about RIGHTOUSNESS, BENEVOLENCE, CONVICTION or whatever else in your face in some attempt to justify the protagonists actions. Too bad everything good about the narration completely falls apart once Yukimura takes over and the story moves to Osaka... Yes, Chacha is the biggest issue, but it's not like the problems stop with her. Honestly, there isn't anything really wrong with the character itself either (of course she was going to be a cute girl able to defeat thousands of soldiers on her own, this wouldn't be a Musou otherwise), it's just that the game has absolutely no idea on how to make use of her and it keeps beating around the bush without ever addressing the reason why the Siege of Osaka story needs her in the first place. Likewise Yukimura acts like a simple spectator throughout the whole Osaka arc instead of actually bonding with Mitsunari's faction (you know, like marrying Yoshitsugu's daughter and having a son with her) and the feud itself feels more like children bickering among each others than a real conflict. I can't even blame Koei for turning Gracia's story into a joke, having her die because of such a farce would have been completely out of place. On the other hand I've aprreaciated a bit what they did Ieyasu and Hidetsugu, but it's not really enough to balance out the mess done with the main characters. In the end the Siege of Osaka climax misses all the elements that make it such a good story and the events make no sense at all; it's basically just two madmen putting up a fight against the whole world for no reason (beside kiiiinda liking a dead guy who held them hostages). I'm almost tempted to say that the last chapter was rushed, especially since characters development goes nowhere and there aren't many cutscenes in general, but they've actually doubled down with an epilogue after it, which is equally pointless. I wouldn't care much about all of this if the game was just your ordinary Musou where the story segments are some 3 minutes long intermissions between battles, but Spirit of Sanada is made to be centred on its story, even going as far as completely sacrificing the traditionally vast selection of playable characters and dedicating entire chapters to storytelling with no fights. Really can't understand how Koei failed to tell the great story Spirit of Sanada deserved... They had some amazing material to work with and the story has already been adapted multiple times for television, so it's not like they didn't have a reference (heck, Koei collaborating on the taiga drama with the same name was probably the only reason why this project started). Also, they've actually did a far better job with the Osaka Siege on Nobunaga Ascension, which isn't really the type of game known for having for having a good story (or a story at all). |
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