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| Samurai Warriors (2019) | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:20 am (5,238 Views) | |
| LordTerrantos | Wed Nov 15, 2017 4:38 pm Post #51 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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Dynasty Warriors 9 is honestly a big gamble. on one note it can greatly increase the fanbase due to its open world aspect. which they honestly seem to be trying to change the formula of past DW while still maintaining its core. on the other half though, because they been changing weapons again and because alot of characters now share the same weapon. example: Wang Yuanji, Zhang He, and Xun Yu. while i can see why people having a fit about it and also why Omega Force may be doing this because thier reworking things from ground up. it doesn't change the fact this could potentially lose sales. Back to Samurai Warriors though. IF SW5 goes down the open world Route, which i am not even 100% sure it will. there very unlikely to change any character's weapons. like the only time they done this is with Oichi in SW3 and Masamune in SW2. and they pretty much kept those ever since. now if anyone's weapons are going to be changed. it will more then likely be Katsuyori Takeda and Hidetada Tokugawa. and the only one of the two who needs a overhaul change in design is Katsuyori. while Hidetada definitely looks generic he still looks much better then Tubbytada who feels more like a spoiled brat and less like the second Shogun. I also hope the aging system returns because not only can we get some characters some more deadly movesets like what happened to Yukimura. but we could also get some characters looking like more like badasses. I only imagine certain characters will get this though. like Ranmaru Mori honestly would not get it because he doesn't live long. and female characters i don't think they would make them extremely old either. only thing from DW9 i think SW5 could take a lesson from is making the characters look like warriors with a touch of anime influence to appeal to both fans of anime and the more realism fans. |
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| Fūma | Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:23 pm Post #52 |
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The Dragon Has Returned
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I feel that one problem with SW going open world is that the map is much less friendly for that. In DW, the map of China is almost a square if you ignore the few regions in the north and round it a bit. However, the map of Japan is shaped quite differently, making travelling more linear. Just some random image of it ![]() There are also several islands rather than one big mass of land, but I don't think that would be a problem much since ships & boats exist. I also think it would be funny if you could swim between the islands. |
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| Lion of Sagami | Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:51 pm Post #53 |
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I can immagine that at most, some female characters will get more conservative clothes and maybe hair a little white, but in a way similar to Motonari or Kyomasa (and they are still very popular).
I just played DW8XL, but without want be bias, the map of ancient China seems to be very simple. I felt that every area where the characters went was represented by a giant square that covered a quarter of China. It was almost as if Kanto or Chugoku was represented by a castle. The exception is Shikoku, that island is the size of Kanto (which has six clans), but it seemed that only the Chosokabe clan lived there. Yes, the Kono clan appears in SW4 Empire, but I do not remember them in main SW4. Perhaps DW Empire is fairer in fragmenting the regions of China, but I have the impression that Japan has more varieties of places. Edited by Lion of Sagami, Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:53 pm.
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| Maya | Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:38 pm Post #54 |
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I think open world works better for DW. SW should probably rather stick to scenarios. I also think that they should differ between characters that need their own storylines and clan scenarios where it's possible to focus on character interactions. For example an Azai scenario if Gou and Hatsu are ever added could work however some characters like Nou or if ever added Sena/Tsukiyama could profit from own scenarios. |
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| LordTerrantos | Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:49 pm Post #55 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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well your also going by the game not how actual China is. China last i check is like 9.6 million Kilometers and Japan is 378,000 Sq Kilometers. so China is 25 times larger then Japan. Dynasty Warriors and Samurai Warriors in the past made thier maps very simple but thier nothing like how the real japan and china are. but honestly given how much bigger Luoyang is in DW9 http://cdn.gamer-network.net/2017/usgamer/Dynasty-Warriors-9-Shot-05.jpg its safe to assume, the maps wont be as simple. i feel Japan/Samurai Warriors cant benefit from a Open world as much as DW can. and its not that i wouldnt want a open world SW. its just not as possible as DW. given the way the map of Japan/SW is. and how much smaller it is compared to China/DW. like this is how the map of China is in 8: Empires Link and if u compare it to the image Fuma provided from SW. its clear how different japan and china's maps are. and why open world works better for DW. Edited by Mr.Honda, Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:32 am.
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| Lion of Sagami | Wed Nov 15, 2017 11:13 pm Post #56 |
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Sorry for my confusion, but I was just considering the DW and SW maps. Unless they want to include several places that exist in real life, but they never appeared in the game.
Well, it looks like the maps are going to be better on DW9 than DW8. I have not yet finished DW8, but at least the Sun family does not have many good stages, because they all seemed very simple to me.
Like I said before, maybe I need to try to finish DW8, because while it seems to have more places, the places are repetitive. Example: A large desert land with lots of space with a few simple houses, a small forest in a desert land and a huge castle that looks without any decoration. In SW, there is a huge decorated castle, a muddy ground, ice cave and even the deserted regions with some fortifications seems to have a more interesting style than those of DW.
Thanks, as I said in my other post, the map in DW8 Empire seems to be fairer than in DW8 where it's not very clear. And by the way: In Spirit of Sanada, when Yukimura is in Osaka, he can travel through a large region that is supposed to be Osaka (main castle, villages, lakes, markets) or he can travel all over Kinki region and even visiting all the castles of this region? Sorry if I look confused, but I do not know how open this open world system is. Or is it a large area explorable by castle? I do not want to be rude, but if Omega is going to put all the possible region of Japan, then it should be much more complicated to put China, since it is much bigger. On the other hand, I have the impression that the SoS system may be more limited. And in the main game, depending on where the story is, then many characters will have very limited territory. It makes no sense, for example, Motochika to leave Shikoku and tour the region of Kinki while resisting against the Toyotomi clan. For most of the characters, they could only explore all of Japan at the end of the game. Some like Oichi can not do this because he died before the unification of Japan. But maybe free mode can allow that. And that will be easier for chronic mode, do not you think? And sorry if I look like I'm wanting to hate DW, but it's just my impression while I'm still starting to play it. Edited by Mr.Honda, Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:34 am.
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| Last_Stallion | Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:00 am Post #57 |
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That would be better, but I personally found the exploration areas and resource collecting in SoS to be dreadfully boring and would rather have that **** completely cut out. |
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| Artorias | Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:25 am Post #58 |
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Ghost Girls Squad
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They should bring back Oichi and Masamune's child ver from The first Samurai Warriors game. |
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| Queen | Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:33 am Post #59 |
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I doubt they'll bring back child Oichi given Chacha is now a PC Oh unless you mean for the ageing system? Then yeah, that'd be cool Also could give Child Oichi the cup and ball back....
Edited by Queen, Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:34 am.
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| LordTerrantos | Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:44 am Post #60 |
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SoS only lets you explore the main city towns which are: Ueda, Sanada Homeland, Osaka. and small villages (only 2 which basically look the same). and no he cannot travel all over the Kinki region, just through a travel zone/exploration zone. SoS is also more like a Semi-Open World similar to Toukiden 2, though Toukiden 2 feels much bigger in comparison. and is limited in several regards. honestly Chronicle Mode is something that should be restricted to well.....Samurai Warriors Chronicles. where the name of the mode comes from and is derived from. so should stay in that. but as i said i don't really think Open World will work for SW regardless if its in the main story or chronicle mode. if its more like SoS then yes. but if its anything similar to DW9 then no. its best the open world stay with DW and not SW. the idea sounds cool on paper for SW but it really wouldnt work very well. Edited by Mr.Honda, Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:35 am.
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| Katatonia | Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:10 am Post #61 |
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If we get child Oichi back, I'm going to mindfk and put her on the same battlefield as Chacha
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| Ryō Genken | Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:46 am Post #62 |
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Disciplined Mind
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I dont want Open World. They should go for aging system instead. No new character for SW5. Just younger/older version of each character. |
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| Cao Hong 14 | Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:13 am Post #63 |
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The one and only
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I remember before SW4 came out they came out and confirmed that it was being worked on/in development. They do that because for SW4 and now SW5 the gap times between games is pretty long. SW3 came out in 2009 and SW4 came out in 2014, now it's looking like SW5 will be coming out in 2019. I think 2019 makes sense now, because when Koei came out and confirmed SW4's development it was 2012 and the game was released two years later. Now it's 2017 so 2019 would stay true to what happened last time. |
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| Fūma | Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:22 am Post #64 |
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The Dragon Has Returned
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SW5 being released in 2019 would be the 15th anniversary of the series (dear lord how time has flown, I still remember the day I first played SW1 in 2004). And I don't think it would even be released next year anyway because we haven't heard any information about it yet. So yeah, 2019 makes sense. As for new characters, I'd only like to see few this time, about 4 or 5. They need to slow down on adding new characters... we're already around 60 now. The roster can only get bloated from this point and not trimmed down because they're no longer cutting characters, so they have to think carefully who to add from this point onward. |
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| Queen | Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:18 pm Post #65 |
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Yeah I imagine they'll get DW9 out of the way any official annoucement/images or whatever As for characters, less it definitely more, so I'd be on board with only 1-2 new females and 3-5 new males at most tbh |
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| LordTerrantos | Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:49 pm Post #66 |
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Emperor's Retainer
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I think once 2018 - 2019 is here. i definitely would prefer us just getting 7 new characters at best. like this time around we got like 15 new characters, this is of course counting Katsuyori and Hidetada. and if you really want to count them since many people didnt know about them. Naotora, Takatora, and Munenori could also be considered "New". so it would be 18 technically. if we just got 2 new females in SW5 and 5 new males i would be happy. well if thier good additions that is. |
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| Fūma | Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:55 pm Post #67 |
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The Dragon Has Returned
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Yeah, the SW4 saga (if we assume SoS was the last game in it) added quite a lot of characters in total. It basically multiplied the amount of characters by 1.5 (from 40 -> 60) which was perhaps too much. So now they should slow down on new additions so that the roster will stay more manageable for longer. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing some characters get cut but I doubt that will happe. |
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| Lion of Sagami | Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:17 am Post #68 |
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Sorry, but could you clarify to me how this works better for DW than SW? Japan is much smaller than China and then it would not be easier? Anyway I do not understand what you mean by "semi open" and a totally open world. Surely there should be limited area anyway? Or will they really fit every inch of China into the game? I do not see why the need for it all. I really prefer what you mentioned about SoS. And I do not want to look like bias, but it seems like the whole DW system is much more complicated and confuse. No offense, but I do not understand why people are more interested in it than SW. Sorry my confusion, when I talked about the chronic mode, I'm talking about a CAW who can travel around Japan while participating in the fights stories or creates what if. I did not play SW Chronicles, but I suppose that's exactly it.
I preferred that they try to develop the characters they already have. I do not want new characters for the previous one to have to be supportive. How they have changed Kotaro from badly chaotic to someone enigmatic who is super protective and has no ulterior motives. Kai just wanted to prove that she was a strong warrior, but suddenly she turned out to be someone who was supposed to be loyal to the Hojo, but forgot about them as soon as she became a trophy of the Toyotomi clan. I wanted Ujimasa to be added, but probably they will make Hayakawa be a manipulator like Chacha and be the reason why the Siege of Odawara happens. And if Ujimasa is another pretty boy in the top 10 with an impressive move, there will be a lot of people acting as if they've always cared for the Hojo. And this is only with the Hojo, maybe they could add Katsunaga Mori and maybe he overshadows Takakage Kobyakawa. I think that Masayuki, Katsuyori, Hidetada and Chacha could be counts as new in SW5. Especially Hidetada that is not even playable in the main game in SoS. That would leave only two men and one female. Maybe Hojo Ujimasa and Matsu Maeda. And maybe the other male is Hideyori, maybe Omega was able to include him without mentioning that Chacha was a concubine, that I really preferred that they actually show to stop this connotation of "slave trophy". About cutting off the characters, I'm going to build on the ten less popular ones: 1- Goemon Ishikawa (X) 2-Miyamoto Musashi (X) 3-Takeda Shingen 3-Hideyoshi Toyotomi 4-Uesugi Kenshin 5-Ieyasu Tokugawa 6-Tadakatsu 7-Masanori (X) 8-Yoshihiro Shimzau 9-Munenori (X) 10-Yoshimoto Imagawa Those that are marked can certainly be cut. The others are spared only by the importance of them. And I hope CAW's features are improved and I'm certainly going to prefer the SW5 Empire rather than the main game, but that's just my opinion. Edited by Lion of Sagami, Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:25 am.
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| LordTerrantos | Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:30 pm Post #69 |
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@Lion of Sagami: what i mean by semi-open world is its not a true open world game. it just sort of feels like one because its a lot bigger. even Toukiden 2 is not a true open world and its semi-open. both still being a bit restricted. Now why would china work better then japan? other then the obvious Map difference. since China's map actually looks like something you make a open world out of. while Japan's map looks like something that really doesn't work for it. like if you compare other open world games like Witcher or Assassin's Creed Origins, thier also VERY VERY large. and most open world games tend to be complicated to some extent anyway. i am not trying to say i would not like a japan open world but i do not feel its something that should be used for samurai warriors. especially since its no where near as big and half of the cast would not even travel the whole thing to begin with. Hell i dare say Witcher 3's open world is probably much bigger if not the same size as china/DW open world. and free mode may be non-existent in this for all we know. and its kinda simple why people prefer DW to SW in some ways......SW is WAAAAY to simple. its not a challenge, it has nothing complex to it (other then the story), and frankly sometimes games with more complexity tend to sell more because they provide something else. DW8 has that whole rock-paper-scissors format where a certain type of weapon defeats the opposite of it. which provides some challenge. SW has nothing like t hat. i sure there is more advantages DW has then SW, but i am no expert on the whole franchise as i only have played 6, 7, and 8. (all which i found more challenging then SW2/SW4 in some aspects). as i said the CAW thing should be limited to Empires and the Chronicles games. they really have no reason to be in the mainstream games like SW4 or 4-2. and frankly if t hey go down a open world path......what-ifs will probably be tossed out the window as DW9 is going down a full on historical path. no hypothetical at all. well its inevitable that they will add new characters. its the formula by now. every new installment after 2 years or so always addes new characters so they are bound to add new ones. and again even if people start caring about the Hojo because Ujimasa becomes a pretty boy. i don't think that means people ever hated the Hojo. there's just not been enough focus on them this time around, and i seriously doubt there ever will unless they make Ujimasa playable and actual focus on Kai's relationship with Hideyoshi. yeah i think half of the characters u want cut aren't going to happen anyway. and the only reason thier not even popular is because thier not pretty boys and we're going by jjapan's popularity poll we have no idea how popular these guys are over in the west. if they actually add Shingen's retainers like Nobufusa Baba or Masatoyo Naito. it can develop Shingen. if they add actual retainers for Kenshin it will help Kenshin, and etc. Yoshimoto is the only one that has a problem. given most of his achievements are done before Okehazama. and unless SW5 goes before Okehazama. then we are not likely to get any retainer to help him. Masanori Fukushima is also likely to never be cut because he is pretty important. not only as one of Hideyoshi's key retainers but also as one of the people that fought in Sekigahara. Munenori, Goemon, and Musashi are the only ones i can see getting cut.....but chances of anyone getting cut is like 0%. given how even DW9 is bringing everyone back from DW8 Edited by LordTerrantos, Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:31 pm.
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| Lion of Sagami | Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:53 pm Post #70 |
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Sorry, I do not want to be rude, but I think I really need to play more games like this to understand this. Fair Cry Primal and The Sims are considered semi open world, right? Do not get me wrong, I do not see any problem with SW5 being semi open and I would be glad to stroll through territories limited by clan until in the end the whole Japan is unlocked. And sorry, but can DW characters travel wherever they want as they please? And why do their clans seem to have more than a quarter of the territory?
They can make a mode where battlefields have limited regions as it has always been before.
Well, I think this is a matter of opinion because I really think the DW8 system is very complicated and tiring. Also, the battlefields seem poorly worked out, although perhaps this is only with the Sun family (they live in desert? Because it looks like this) and maybe I need to continue the game with another clan. And I also read complaints about cloned weapons and female characters being neglected. And to be fair, I have difficulty understanding the gems system in SW4 II, so I do not think I'm being bias.
Well, I'll give one more chance to finish DW8, because as far as I saw, there was none of it. In fact, if SW had something like that, I would not have noticed either. I always forget even to forge weapons in SW4 Empire.
What if they put up with the exchange system of SW4 Empire? For example, we could use CAW only to replace the NPCs in the main game. I mean, be the playable characters will have appearances that are not historically accurate, why do the NPC have that looks like realistic generic samurai? And they could be selectable in mode free, but as if they were a historical figure. For example, I make a CAW to replace Terumune Date, so it will be treated as such.
Yes, but Hidetada will probably be treated as a new character because he is neither playable in the main game.
Well, I'm not saying that necessarily most hate the Hojo, but many should be just indifferent. I refer to the more casual players who probably do not even realize the existence of Ujimasa. Considering how little time Kai has with Hideyoshi, it's easier for Hayakawa to have a relationship with Ieyasu or Hidetada. Hayakawa historically has more connection to the Tokugawa clan than Kai had with the Toyotomi clan (while Hideyoshi was alive). At best we should have an event with Hideyoshi praising Kai's ability and having an interest in her as a retainer, but that's all.
Yes, that's why I did not mark Shingen and Kenshin with an "X". It's not popular, but it can still serve as support for future characters. I put the top 10 less popular, but I marked the can be cut. Sorry if I was not very clear.
Why can not Yoshimoto be used to develop Naotora? And I just did not mark him because it serves to show Nobunaga's rise and maybe that strange event with Ieyasu means something.
But the problem is that everything he does, is also made by Kyomasa. His presence seems to be redundant. And sorry if I miss something, but what did he do important in Sekigahara that makes him different from other officers? It's not that I hate him or anything, but all I remember is that he hates Mitsunari.
And as an example, I do not know why Munenori and Masanori are very different. Masanori seems more frequent and seems to be more solid in a certain way and historically he was more important than Munenori. But if he really can add something special, then Omega has a great work to do with it. |
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| LordTerrantos | Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:28 pm Post #71 |
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@Lion of Sagami: well i cant really answer how much characters can travel in DW9, but from what i seen while a character's story is limited to how long they were alive. (so thier story ends the moment they historically died). from what i seen a good portion of the game characters can travel. across china. but of course i havent seen much on this aspect of the game to know for sure. all i can say it be better if SW5 just does something more like SoS and less like DW9. Well another difference is, Japan has many small provinces and thousands of small clans. i been playing Nobunaga's ambition and its clear there is plenty of smaller clans, and also they mostly captured castles and stuff while the three kingdoms had small countries or large countries/provinces so of course these kingdoms have alot more territory then any clan in Samurai warriors has ever had. Also you got to remember, this in ancient china during thousands and thousands of years ago during the years of AD 184/220–280 (if i am remembering correctly). where the Sengoku Era during the years of 1467 – c. 1603 (though in samurai warriors the game starts in 1560 with Battle of Okehazama) DW 8 problem is it added characters that really had no role to play in the overall story. bu DW9 is actually adding characters that can actually add stuff to the story. and yes currently for some unknown reason DW9 is having multiple characters share weapons. and frankly DW is infamous for changing characters weapons too much. unlike SW where it has only done this twice and only with Oichi and Masamune. and frankly DW has a longer life span to work with then Samurai Warriors, not only because it was made first but because unlike SW4 it hasn't removed any important battles as far as i am aware. yeah i really doubt they would allow us to replace NPCS in the main game even with a CAW. because said NPCS may be a important historical figure. like if we just removed Masamune's dad's npc what would be his motivation for trying to take over Oshu? and there NPCS so of course thier going to be made to look generic. in a warriors game. its not like this is witcher where each NPC looks unique. Yeah Hidetada most likely will be treated as new, same with the other characters in SoS and even Naomasa. but i doubt this will stop them from adding actual new characters. the simplest reason is Yoshimoto is introduce immediately when he is killed. at the Battle of Okehazama. and this has always how he has been introduced since SW2. there really is little room for them to develop Yoshimoto with Naotora because of this. they have better chances developing Naotora with Ieyasu or Tadakatsu. Its not that he hates Mitsunari at least in game. its just that he wants things to go back to normal. though in history he and Kiyomasa both hated Mitsunari. and honestly while i cant remember what he did at Sekigahara. i know he was one of the key people on the tokugawa team. and of course he is also one of the key figures of the toyotomi and tried to maintain the toyotomi's survival and control. but of course ieyasu strip him of his lands and Kiyomasa's after sekigahara. More or less Masanori and kiyomasa are important but maybe not as much as other figures. Munenori is really pointless in comparison to Masanori. Hell even Musashi could of been made important but they didn't. In Munenori's case the only thing he is known for his created a martial arts school of his swordsmanship and for teaching Hidetada. |
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| Lion of Sagami | Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:29 pm Post #72 |
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In that case, just have to wait to see what will happen.
But still, will each of these "countries" have an enormous amount of villages and castle repeated? Would anyone really want to make a character travel a place as big as China? Sorry, but I personally prefer the idea of semi open because I can not understand why it would be interesting to explore an infinite area. Japan is smaller, but that's why I think I'm going to have more fun.
Well, the problem is that DW already has many characters. I would not be surprised that SW5 will also have this problem.
Sorry for my confusion, but I meant that the CAW could just replace the move and appearance of the historical character. For example, maybe Terumune is not wearing good clothes, so we could use caw to replace his clothes. But Terumune would still be Terumune, even the name does not have to be changed. I think in SW3 it was possible to edit the clothes of the playable characters. Yukimura could have blue armor, but he would still be Yukimura. I do not want to be rude, but what's wrong with creating completely new warriors? It's not like the game tried to be a historical documentary. And yes, Omega said that DW9 would follow more historical accuracy (although it is based on legends from two thousand years ago), but did not even show some ideas for SW5.
I did not mean that they will not put new characters because of Hidetada, but they might want to add seven characters and decide that developing Hidetada could already consume time for a seventh character. Terumune is not even playable, but it is used to develop Masamune.
More or less Masanori and kiyomasa are important but maybe not as much as other figures.[/quote] Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but Masanori did not make a small inner rebellion with a troop of "Anti-Mitsunari"? Not to mention that he punched Mitsunari because he did not want to explain orders, so it seems that he hates Mitsunari. And why did Ieyasu punish Masanori and Kiyomasa? Did not they stay on the eastern side? And is it my impression or Ieyasu more punish than reward?
Well, considering that most of the female characters have never fought historically, then men who have not played a real role on the battlefield are not exactly absurd. Still, Munenori does not seem to add anything like Okuni. It has had some importance in a certain way, but they do not do anything with it in the game. In that case, Hayakawa was lucky to have an original storyline for the first part of the game, but then her loyalty for the Tokugawa clan seems to be as simple as Masanori and Munenori. |
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| LordTerrantos | Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:09 pm Post #73 |
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@Lion of Sagami: not going to reply to everything u said because i am half asleep at the moment. China and Japan are both very popular countries in gaming in my opinion. and i sure there is a good portion of people who would like to travel across china's vass landscape. especially if its in Dynasty warriors which is far mroe popular then samurai warriors whether you like it or not. and a open world is not for everyone but it does give you more options to do. i cant speak for everyone as i only haved played a small amount of open world games. but they do give alot more potential for the series then a semi-world would. the only backlash i see DW9 getting is the clone weapons thats it. Yeah DW9 current confirmed roster is like 90 or so. SW4 as of Spirit of Sanada has a roster of 61. and lets say we only get like 7 new characters in SW5. then the roster would go to being 68. which is still a lot even if not as much so as DW9 if its just colors that would be change then maybe that could work. but you got to remember these clans also had a color scheme to them. which is why most of the tokugawa wear bluish colors minus Tadakatsu, Naotora, and Naomasa. most of the Oda have Black or Purplish colors. the Toyotomi have gold (even tho i admit most of the designs of the toyotomi in SW4 didnt have this). nothing wrong with creating new warriors just i think its bet left in a game that has nothing to do with the main story. such as SW4: Empires or Samurai warriors chronicles. if its in the mainstream game like SW4 or SW4-2. it shouldnt exist in there at all. Yeah Terumune is used to develop Masamune but there is more motivation to it. Yoshimoto would hardly have the time to develop Naotora because he stays in the main camp of Okehazama, gets ambushed. then dies. while Naotora is somewhere else on the battlefield no where near Yoshimoto. not exactly good enough to give development. Yes he punished them because of thier large influences with the Toyotomi CLan. and it is said in legends and some documents Kiyomasa had a knife on him at all times in case Ieyasu did something that would go against the favor of the Toyotomi. Ieyasu couldnt trust these two they were way to loyal to the Toyotomi and the only reason they helped Ieyasu was due to thier own petty grudge against Mitsunari. and yes Ieyasu punished alot mroe then he rewarded after sekigahara but really u can't afford to be a saint during these times. i am not going to say Ieyasu was a saint or pure evil, but he overall is the reason japan got unified. he had to remove any possible rebellions against the tokugawa and that meant taking lands from many powerful daimyo who either opposed him at sekigahara or possibly were a threat to the peace he wanted to make. but again i am not going to defend Ieyasu here but he had good reasons for why he did what he did. yeah as i said i think you are overestimating Hayakawa. she got a large role in the game. more so then Munenori who is a tokugawa character yet hardly has any real motivations. and there is far too many other characters who could of been developed more then her. and i am not being cynical at all here. she got a good enough screentime in all the games so really i think she was treated rather well. all things considered. compared to the Tachibana, Ranmaru, Musashi, Kojiro, Goemon, the Date, the Mori, the chosokabe, and etc. who hardly got anything focused on them |
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| Lion of Sagami | Sat Nov 18, 2017 2:27 am Post #74 |
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Sorry, I do not want to be rude, but why do you still insist on DW's popularity when I'm not even denying it? On the other hand, I have a hard time finding any DW game in the stores and never hear about it off the internet. So logically, SW should be an obscure game because it is much less popular. And even if SW was more popular, I do not know why it would need an open world. I mean, how does this concept work? Even China has limits, even if it is much larger than Japan. But the only difference I can imagine is that the area of Japan would be bounded by the sea, while China would have been conveniently surrounded by mountains. I'm not being bias, I just do not understand the appeal of this open-world idea. And I do not mean I hate DW, but I just do not like popular things that seem to be being pushed into my face, this just makes seem overrated. Maybe SW works best for me because I'm interested in story, not to be a hardcore player or something like that.
And that's exactly why I think I'll enjoy SW5 Empire more, but that will be a long time.
Well, that will depend on what Omega will want to do, I think we do not have anything to think about too much about it yet.
Sorry but I was not criticizing Ieyasu but just asking why he had done it since the game does not show because he would do something like that. He even says that Hideyori would be set aside because he had nothing to do with Sekigahara. If Hideyori is not punished, why does Masanori and Kyomasa have to be? He does not even look angry when Kyomasa insists on considering Hideyori his lord. Only Takatora complained, but that was it. Historically it makes sense, but the game did not do a good job or I miss something.
and there is far too many other characters who could of been developed more then her. and i am not being cynical at all here. she got a good enough screentime in all the games so really i think she was treated rather well. all things considered. compared to the Tachibana, Ranmaru, Musashi, Kojiro, Goemon, the Date, the Mori, the chosokabe, and etc. who hardly got anything focused on them[/quote] I'm not saying she was the least developed, but I'm simply saying what I expect from Hayakawa in the next SW. In fact, Hayakawa does not even need more screen time than in SW4. She could easily have had a better story in SW4 II after the Siege of Odawara if they had not opted for rivals and focused on her relationship with the Tokugawa clan (any one of them). The Mori clan also just needs more interesting dialogues and subjects than simply talking about strategies. I am surprised that Motonari peacefully lived up to the Siege of Odawara to do nothing. Now the rest you mentioned really need more screen time than in SW4 like Ranmaru because it can not be developed with the same amount of time it took in SW4, I do not even remember in what event it appeared. The same goes for Ginchiyo, Muneshige and Nene. |
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| Mr.Honda | Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:58 am Post #75 |
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2019 huh? I can live with that ... maybe I'll finish Spirit of Sanada by then Some of the things I've seen them do with DW9 have me excited for what they can do with SW series, but since I've been more interested in SW series lately, that also means any drastic changes they make along the way could upset me even more, so we'll see
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