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maybe a bug?; MT and arc. schol.
Topic Started: Oct 1 2012, 06:09 AM (122 Views)
Er_Nano_Infame
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EL NANO!!
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i tried a build with the vordan creator, with scod hak packs included.
made a mystic theurge with sorcere/cleric, but i wanted to put in it arcane scholar too.

noticed if i took firstly the 10 lvls of MT and then the 10 lvls of arcane scholar, with or without a sorc lvl between them, it wouldn't allow me to pick the sorc spells progression feat from the arc. schol. first lvl, unableing to advance in sorc spell casting any more (but the 10 lvl of MT yet satisfied the arc. schol. requirement of 3rd lvl spells).

alternatively, i could take the arc. schol. before the MT , but this would mean taking 6 lvls of sorc to satisfy the 3rd lvl spells requirement, and then another to gain the missing spells from the known bug of the MT , reducing those of cleric.

another way was to take 4 cleric, 1 sorc, then 10 of mt, then 5 of sorc so that arc- schol. would give sorc progression properly.

because

in any way, this means i had to take some lvls of sorc that wouldn't be needed without such ''bug'' explained above, thus reducing the cleric lvls.

so the reason seems to be that arc. schol. keeps in count the pure lvls of sorc. if it isn't at a level (6th) where it would get the 3rd circle, it won't work, even if the 3rd circle is gained via mystic theurge. or maybe MT doesn't qualify to satisfy prerequisites for another PRC...

so cleric stop progressing at 7th lvl spells


is it a real bug in scod, or just the vordan messed up with the haks?

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cryptc
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This is a well known problem of the engine, when requiring a specific spell level, it doesn't actually count prc's for this requirement.

Same behaviour can also be seen if you are cleric 5 stormlord 10 and try to pick warpriest.

Unfortunately no known fix to this issue.
"One of the most curious statements I've seen on this list is that PlaneScape is a logical world. I must have erred. I was trying to create a world that defied logic." - David 'Zeb' Cook
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Er_Nano_Infame
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booooh

:(
Maewind:''That's still plant-hating! That makes you a plant racist!''

Lucelle Vand'hovar: ''Miss Maewind, i assure you, the plants started this conflict.''

Nienna: ''Razorvine is hardly a plant, in her defense.''

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WhenWizardsWar
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Im not sure i understand the problem but to make a complicated problem easier to fix.

If i have my math right

First six levels
3 cleric
3 sorcerer

levels 7 and 8 mystic theruge=5th level cleric/sorc spells=3rd level spells which should take care of the arcane scol sorc progression issue.

Then level up as you will.

Im assumeing your build would end up

sorc5/cleric5/mystic10/arcan scol 10(sorc)

this will give you a caster level of

25th arcane caster level
15th level caster cleric

So yes your cleric spells will be topped out at level 7 so i highly suggest you take "spell casting cleric" so even though you effectivly have 15 levels of clerics for the purpose of spell access youll cast all your cleric spells as if you were 19th level, (this wont give you any extra spell levels/slots but it WILL boost the strength of your divine spells which would stop at level 7 spells, its a great way to help ease the fact your stuck with level 7 cleric spells).

I play:
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krandate123
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The problem is an engine issue. All prestige classes that require a certain caster level to achieve do not look at the actual caster level of all combined classes, they look at the levels in the base class. So you need to be a lvl 6 sorcerer or lvl 5 wizard to have lvl 3 spells, which is required for pale master, arcane scholar or eldritch knight. Taking 5 levels of sorc and 1 level of mystic theurge (with something 1 level of cleric for example) will still only give you 5 levels of sorc when the engine looks at the character to determine if they meet the feat requirements to add the feat to increase caster level as a sorcerer. It is possible to manually add the feat, but DMs would have to do this on a case by case basis (annoying and tedious, also not their job). The problem is that even if you only qualify for these classes as either a sorcerer or a wizard, you still have to choose the feat to increase your spellcasting power in one of those classes.

So basically to meet the requirements you would need to have 6 levels of sorcerer or 5 levels of wizard and be able to cast 3rd level spells purely based on levels in that class. I hope that makes sense.

One interesting side note is that red wizard does not have this restriction, as it can only add spell casting levels to wizard and not sorcerers. So you don't have to choose which class to increase spell casting power in, which makes it work automatically.

Also, contrary to what WWW says, you would need 6 levels of sorc to take ASOC. My suggested build would be sorc 6/cleric 7/theurge 10/ASOC 7. ASOC 10 gives you access to improved quicken which is...err...broken as crap anyway. But you'd be trading 3 wizard caster levels which increases spell DCs nicely for lvl 8 and 9 cleric spells, so if you want a power caster you might go with the extra ASOC levels.

As a side note, a sorc 6/wizard 7/theurge 10/ASOC 7 build as an archmage would also be an obscenely OPed offensive caster, spamming maximized and empowered IGMS. But hey...let's not turn this into a powerbuild discussion.
Partial Character List:
Chardon: Mystic theurge lich. Devourer of souls and those little powdery mints people have at weddings.
Akki Takki: Kobold rebuker. Raised as a petitioner in the court of Kurtulmak before fleeing.
Opkfrumjotunn: Troll beserker. Planar mercenary.
Az'kar: Bladeling assassin. Noms on his victims.
Tyiedrni Pohuunrakihu: Skeletal minion of Chardon. Not much of a reader.
Lorkata: Self proclaimed prophet of Chaos, Doomguard member.
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