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| Winterwolf Attack Bonus | |
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| Topic Started: Aug 10 2014, 03:54 AM (314 Views) | |
| Lucereflame | Aug 10 2014, 03:54 AM Post #1 |
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ok so i am back and have decided to play a Winterwolf. i am currently rogue 1 figher one.. 20 dex so +5 dex mod. i started with my attacks being roughly +3 -2.. might have bene a little worse.. right now on my character sheet since i am lvl 2 its says +5/0 . but when battle comes it still is +3 -2. anyone know why it is like this. also For Creatures with natural attacks is there a weapon focus natural attack that i can take. or would that be considered a melee touch attack? |
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| Ninefingers | Aug 10 2014, 04:32 AM Post #2 |
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Greybeard
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Multiattack imposes a -2 bonus to all attacks, I believe, which is why you're getting those figures. As to the weapon focus, I think taking unarmed focus/critical applies to creature weapons, but I could very well be wrong on that. My source is a vague memory of the blurb on the totemic barbarian, so it's probably flawed. |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 10 2014, 09:50 PM Post #3 |
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I should have before multi attack a 6 attack bonus 1 from fighter 5 from dex on the char sheet it shows 5 and 0 |
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| Er_Nano_Infame | Aug 10 2014, 10:35 PM Post #4 |
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EL NANO!!
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multiattack gives -2 instead of -5 if the creature has more than 3 attacks, otherwise adds one attack with the usual -5, and this malus shouldnt apply to the first attack as far as i recall. are you sure you have weapon finesse, lucere? and more over, is it assured creature attack works with weapon finesse? |
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Maewind:''That's still plant-hating! That makes you a plant racist!'' Lucelle Vand'hovar: ''Miss Maewind, i assure you, the plants started this conflict.'' Nienna: ''Razorvine is hardly a plant, in her defense.''
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| Lucereflame | Aug 11 2014, 12:06 AM Post #5 |
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yes i am sure i have weapon finess. my base attack is +1. my str bonus would be from 16. a +3. my dex is 20 at +5 mod.. overall it should be either +6 for finess. +4 for strength based. if what above is true than it should be finessable because it is an unarmed attack |
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| Plaxy100 | Aug 11 2014, 12:22 AM Post #6 |
Does not infact have a Greybeard
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You are getting the str cause creature weapons and finesse don't work your also a large creature as winter wolf so in cure a -1 to ab Edit. Dumb phones auto correct |
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GMT: -8. Player Tag: Plaxy100 Steamtag: Plaxy186 Characters: Merrium Pinklily (The Red Death Hin) Brandon Burnfire (Master Evoker) Zinex (half lune warlock) Sssylvgh (Yuan-ti Arcane trickster) Timothy Jack (Bard of the Fated) | |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 11 2014, 12:28 AM Post #7 |
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alright so i tested it again. . a Monk lvl 1 had a +4 -1 attack. which was on the character sheet. this is without finess The rogue lvl 1 character had a 3, -2 which was seen on character sheet now the rogue lvl 1.. fighter lvl 1. had a +3 -2 also. this was even with weapon finess. )character sheet showed a 5,0 . so as stated above i would assume its that finess dose not work with creature weapons. since these are technically natural attacks is their a way to make this work? |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 11 2014, 02:33 AM Post #8 |
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ok Tested out another character this one without Multiattack.. a golem pure fighter so lvl 1. he has a 16 str mod with items. his attacks should be +17 but remained at 16 for the first level ( i factored in a -1 for size). So i now leveled to 2. I took weapon focus unarmed. (since they get unarmed because of their level.) ends up.. that that dose not effect the natural attacks. So i have come up with the conclusion that Weapon finess, and Weapon focuses will not effect the Attack bonuses for monsterous humanoids who use creature weapons. Thus i guess we can close this topic unless we can make a work around to allow them to be considered a type of weapon. or something |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 11 2014, 04:44 PM Post #9 |
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so after testing out other races i think i might have found a work around. if you look at the Werewolf and its Wolf form. it has an attack tree that has all the seperate attacks he would get listed under his main attack. i dont know if this would be effected by the change but i will be looking into it soon |
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| Ceremorph | Aug 12 2014, 01:58 AM Post #10 |
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Dark Mistress of the Toolset
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A quick question: does the golem actually gain a creature attack the way it's being implemented (which would require you to actually equip the attacks)? There are special weapon focus feats (Weapon Focus: Creature) that would need to be taken to work with these, and I'm pretty certain that this type of attack (a Slam) doesn't work with Finesse. If you don't have an equipped creature attack, then you're going to be the same as an empty-handed human, just stronger. |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 12 2014, 02:23 AM Post #11 |
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Golem starts with the auto equiped special attack (the electric damadge is added). and i tested weapon focus for unarmed attack.. as for weapon finess.. i tested that on the winter wolf and as far as i can see it dosent work. i never was given the option to equip the monster attack as either. i am going to run a test with weapon finess on a werewolf in Wolf form. their attack is actually from what i can see created differently because on character sheet it lists attack bonus and than all the different attacks below it . but i need to level the werewolf once for it to work |
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| Agony_Aunt | Aug 15 2014, 03:22 PM Post #12 |
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Get a Life
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I've documented most of this here and there over time, but ill summarize. All the while remember a) the character sheet can lie, and b) Obsidian really didn't implement creature weapons very well. 1) Any special race that comes with creature weapons gets as a minimum Weapon Proficiency (Creature). 2) All unarmed feats except specialization feats work with creature weapons. To get specialization bonuses you have to take the appropriate creature weapon versions of the feats. If i did my job right then if you have weapon proficiency creature then you qualify for the unarmed weapon specialization feats you qualify for the equivalent creature weapon versions of those feats as well and should take them instead (if you are going with creature weapons and not removing them via the styx oarsman - otherwise you want unarmed). 3) Weapon Finesse does not work with creature weapons. They are considered medium weapons (i guess obisidian did this because otherwise large creatures would not be able to equip creature weapons if they were small). 4) Multiattack gives a -2 instead of -5 to creature weapon attacks for subsequent attacks. Its a very nice feat. You cannot take this feat on level up, either your race gets it, or it doesn't (unless its added via a special ability) 5) Creature weapons do not display their names in the character sheet, so simply bunches up all weapons without proper spacing as a single entry, making it harder to read. 6) Creature weapons, if you have more than 1 are selected randomly. Hence those special races who have something extra on one of their creature weapons will not always get the same effects when attacking depending on which creature weapon is chosen. As i recall with 3 attacks its something like 35% left claw, 35% right claw, 30% bite (claw/bite here are just convenient terms, the weapons could be bludgeoning or whatever). |
| Stepped down as admin, but still lurking. | |
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| Lucereflame | Aug 16 2014, 05:19 AM Post #13 |
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thankyou for clarifying it.. also i realize the large sized creatures all have a negative 1 to their rolls. is this because they are large? |
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| Ceremorph | Aug 16 2014, 10:17 PM Post #14 |
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Dark Mistress of the Toolset
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So Agony... are you saying that Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, GWF, GWS, and Power Critical for creature weapons are all in-game available for characters with creature proficiency? And with that said, do we also want to consider implementing ImpCrit, EWF, and EWS for creature weapons? |
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We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of the thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder. | |
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| Agony_Aunt | Aug 17 2014, 04:30 AM Post #15 |
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Get a Life
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Just weapons spec line of feats. As i mentioned the rest of the feats work fine with the unarmed feats. So, if you were wanting a pure fighter winter wolf focusing on creature weapons you would grab feats like so: Weapon Focus (Unarmed) Weapon Spec (CW) GWF (Unarmed) GWS (CW) EWF (Unarmed) EWS (CW). Its a bit fiddly, and i can't help but think i should be able to change it is that it would all be one or the other. When i was initially testing all this (back when i was working on the Druid changes), i tried changing the Weapon Spec feats for Creature Weapons to Unarmed but it didn't seem to work. After adding giant weapons i'm half convinced now that i must have made a mistake, it really should be changeable. I think ill add an issue to github to review this again. |
| Stepped down as admin, but still lurking. | |
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