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Sure Is Quiet!
Topic Started: Apr 15 2017, 10:28 PM (3,990 Views)
DaftyXIII
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Greybeard
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Ariella,Apr 19 2017
03:04 PM
Perma death is something that can happen. However with our current views on it, to avoid the issues that come with perma killing a PC. You are typically warned by the DM before the action takes place of the risk involved in continuing that action. I have used this is my time here a few times but almost always the player opts out, Which to me displays the lack of enjoyment people would find if it became more commonly enforced.

that would make sense, yeah.

I can live with that, you wont be hearing anything about that topic from me anymore :P .
“For me, insanity is super sanity. The normal is psychotic. Normal means lack of imagination, lack of creativity." - Jean Dubuffet
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rapsam2003
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Mr_Otyugh,Apr 19 2017
04:32 PM
I'm not particularly opposed to perma-death, but improperly applied, it becomes very easily a toxic feature. I've killed off a few of my own characters, but they've always been for story reasons. I'm honestly not particularly interested of having perma-death be determined by PvP matters, because then it's not really story relevant, just build.

Agree 100%. It needs to be story-driven!
The Cambion Morthos: Athar Warlock
Vaggol'cyth Krahl: Tiefling Cipher

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CheeseWedge
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CheesePencils
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Didn't mean to get into a huge permadeath debate. xP What I really meant was just the feeling of more consequences and rewards to what you're doing. It doesn't necessary have to be permadeath, but the fear of death certainly has a way of keeping characters from acting like invincible idiots. That sort of behavior sort of breaks immersion for me.

(Muh immershuns!)

But if you're willing to accept a plot or go through with an action that has high risk attached to it, a real chance of failure and something bad happening, I personally think it makes a story all the more interesting and the possible reward more... rewarding.
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NeverOutPunned
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Part of the problem with perma-death risk events or story line is that the reward has, in my experience, never been worth the risk. Rewards are usually a sharply limited sum of gold or xp, the later of which isn't helpful for a lvl 30 not planning to rebuild and the former is never enough to justify risk taking as some manner of policy. Most of the time when you have any real control over the outcome of an event, ala, a group with people of similar mechanical power in a small group where the DM can pay attention, your fighting over personal plot points which have no real larger impact.
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zethrenx99
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Risk doesn't need to be permadeath as he said. Can always look at risk in curses, persistent injuries, blocked chi, possession, domination, captivity, damnation, banishements, aroused ire of guilds of assassins or thieves or gypsies. . . I mean there are a plethora of negative side effects to failing some sort of plot, and whats more they give additional plot hooks to follow up on :D
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Mick64
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Quote:
 
Any playable character, no matter how "powerful", can die in Sigil.


That's not even true though. We have many races who are incredibly hard to permanently kill. Vampires and Liches are obvious, but Outsiders who "die" anywhere that is not their native plane simply "repawn" on their native plane. (Though this respawning process is not instantaneous).
Scripter.

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zethrenx99
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Also if i'm not mistaken we are RP capped to level 15? So really the most powerful of us is still only a level 15 :P
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Mausman
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With risk of stepping on some toes....

If you RP your character not being afraid of death in this setting, you are a poor RP'er in general, even without risk of permadeath.

Just saying, sorry, not sorry.

Kelth has been asked to help to deal with a potential risky thing. He is clenching his butt-cheeks and even wents as far as to order a flipping shield for it.

He also has parameters under which he will move on with it. He has been through death twice now (and only by efforts of other players, been brought back) he REALLY shits his pants about possibly dying, even if he is as big as a door and and all.

Death isn't just another loaf of bread you buy at the bakery. RP accordingly <3
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Theodoreick
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I recall Richard Bartle used a particularly colourful expression when asked what he thought of permadeath in a virtual world. :D

Regardless I think that both permadeath and character wipe are definitely NOT the way to stimulate the server and the player count.
PnP, Pencil-and-paper: the term refers to the ancient tools that were available to early roleplaying humankind. The pencil was a long piece of wood that contained a soft, staining, carbon-based material called graphite encased inside. Early roleplaying humans would scrape the pencil across the surface of paper. Paper was the term used to describe an early form of random access memory, consisting of pressed tree pulp that was smooth and designed to easily absorb the scrapings of pencil graphite.
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Tomekk
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Dark Soul
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Mausman,Apr 21 2017
12:38 PM
If you RP your character not being afraid of death in this setting, you are a poor RP'er in general, even without risk of permadeath.

I suppose Berserkers are all bad RPers then. Or Dustmen for that matter, who seek True Death beyond that which most creatures experience. :(

But I'll give you the benefit of a doubt and assume you meant people who think their characters are invincible. Yes, that's usually not very good RP and doesn't lead to meaningful characters.
"From the realms below we ride,
And in terror they run and hide,
From the shadows of old we rise,
Awakened, from the dark!

Over the ancient ruins we fly,
Where the old kings go to die,
And the new kingdoms rising high,
Awakened, from the dark, dark slumber!"
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Whitefly
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Back when I used to do a bit of RP on Guild Wars 2, I found an escalating problem wherein people would create a character, roleplay them for a few months, permakill them and make a new character; wash, rinse, repeat. It got very tiresome very quickly for two main reasons:

1) It's a bunch of lame edgy emo trash

2) It meant character development was at an all time low, because every time you tried to form a relationship the other guy would drop dead and then you'd be roleplaying with the same person IRL except they have a new character and a bunch of awkward meta knowledge and familiarity with your character.

It sucked, in other words.

Just adding permadeath doesn't solve the problem of people not fearing death in a game, it simply means some dullards churn out characters who have the ridiculous premise of surviving their entire lives no problem up until the point they become controlled by the player, at which point their life expectancy drops to a maximum 6 months, like roleplaying were some incurable tropical disease.
Moxie Anafara Angas, aka Ixsaea; delightful Xaositectiefling
Kismet Saljahasa; "really friendly" air elemental sort
Ravvi Beaconberry; adorable hin adventuress
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DigitalDragoon
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Having played on a server before with strictly enforced permadeath, I can say without a doubt that permadeath does not lead to people treating the setting or the prospect of being killed with any more real respect.

If anything I have seen forced permadeath used to show off how 'badass' a character is for not being 'afraid' (and the people screeching that no one takes death seriously along with it). I have seen it provoke seemingly decent people to actively turn to power-gaming and exploits to 'save' their character. Most irritatingly though, I've seen it used to bully other players, as a toxic expectation develops for your character to die after a certain period of time and that being invested in your character is considered a bad thing.

As much as I am for people rping the logical consequences to their actions, I do not see arbitrary dictated permadeath as necessarily improving anything. It should only be forced in situations that it would make sense for. (ie. Jumping headlong into an unknown portal seething with evil energy, Going around wantonly murdering people and getting caught, trying to cheese off the Lady of Pain.)
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Ariella
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Mausman,Apr 21 2017
09:38 AM
With risk of stepping on some toes....

If you RP your character not being afraid of death in this setting, you are a poor RP'er in general, even without risk of permadeath.

Just saying, sorry, not sorry.

Kelth has been asked to help to deal with a potential risky thing. He is clenching his butt-cheeks and even wents as far as to order a flipping shield for it.

He also has parameters under which he will move on with it. He has been through death twice now (and only by efforts of other players, been brought back) he REALLY shits his pants about possibly dying, even if he is as big as a door and and all.

Death isn't just another loaf of bread you buy at the bakery. RP accordingly <3

That's primer talk :D. For half of Sigil death is meaningless, it is the loaf of bread.

You have outsiders who can't die unless on their own plane, A death on a prime means a thousand years banishment but a death on another plane entirely meaningless. We have some undead who require a destroyed phylactery or stake. Fey who require to be at odds with their court or in the case of shadow fey die under sun light. Dragons who's arrogance brings them to a level where they believe them selfs immortal or Dustmen who are already dead. All this is before we take into account ability's that render you immune to fear both magical and mundane, Ever wonder why that lowbie paladin charged into that abyss portal?.

The moment planescape is considered death takes on a very different meaning for different races. Which is why most primers consider outsides strange and hard to comprehend. While people in general advance with a fear of death often as a motivation to achieve something life, Or an acceptance of a religion and after life. Planner creatures work on different motivations with plans that far exceed a mortal life span.

Do not hesitate to send me a PM if you:
- Require assistance with a staff or player conflict
- Would like to join the testing team
- Waiting on a staff ruling for longer then a week
- Want to join or start an event for the Harmonium, Transcendent Order, or Free League

Trissa, Sensate Factotum - True Wisdom and knowledge comes from experience.
Beladra d'Phiarlan, Harmonium Namer - I will bleed for my Golden Harmony, Get in our way and so will you.
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rgzrrsdz
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Most people I played with including myself (I would say 7 people including myself) have gone over to Haven because we did not like the rules change with the OOC and Discord. They added so much stuff there like new classes, races, repeatable quests, and DMs are on almost daily doing plot stuff...

When I come on Sigil to play its hard to find people because there used to be 30-40 players online... now its like 5-15 on most days... 20 if you're lucky. I think one morning I logged online and there was only 4 people including myself...
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CaCO3
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